What???? That doesn't make ANY sense.

 

If you don't double clutch, when you shift at highway speeds from 5th to 3rd, your car will "load up"... so to speak.

It's difficult to describe, but what happens is your revs increase *while you're in gear*, causing the car to slow down (equivalent to downshifting to slow the vehicle down)

Double-clutching, on the other hand, allows you to rev-match. Therefore, when you go into the lower gear, you are theoretically at that rpm (or near it) already. so, you can let the clutch out quicker and then just hit the gas and go, vs. regular downshifting in which you have to come off the clutch slower and wait for the car to rev up.

All I can say is to try downshifting normally, and then double clutch. You will see (and feel) what I'm talking about.

 

I don't think I get what you are talking about, either.

If I want to use the engine to help me slow down when downshifting (like a light turning yellow on you when you are in that "should I go or should I stop zone), I push in the clutch, downshift 1 gear, and let the clutch out... that with the brake really slows down the car.

If I want to match revs when coming to a light, I push in the clutch, downshift 1 gear, and at the same time blip the throttle... when I let the clutch out, the revs are matched and the engine doesn't slow down the car.

It all depends on how quickly I want/need to stop.

 

EXACTLY...that's what double clutching is. Although, technically, I think with double clutching you actually place the car into neutral for a *brief* moment. Instead of blipping the throttle with the clutch engaged, you blip it in neutral (gives the same effect, obvoiusly, but I think it allows better rpm matching)

What I'm referring too is doing that same thing to ACCELERATE, not decelerate.

Also, technically you could still slow the engine down by double-clutching, by letting the engine speed slow you down once you get it into gear.

 

This statement sure confuses me a bit.

Did you mean "decelerating'"? Do you mean "heel and toe downshifting"?

Double clutching is NOT the same as heel and toe - blipping the throttle with another part of your foot to rev match. Double clutching was necessary before synchronized gears and is not used to rev match anymore, except by truckers:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double_declutch

 

EXACTLY...I mean neither.

Double clutching is a method, as I stated in the post above, that allows you to rev-match when downshifting that allows better acceleration and puts less strain on your car.

When doing a gradual DECELERATION (ie-when turning from a 45 mph to a 25 mph road), you don't really need to double-clutch, because the revs aren't excessive. What I do is just slow down, push in the clutch, change gears, and come off the clutch.

This is compared to going 60 mph, and wanting to accelerate to 75 mph. In this case, I would push the clutch, shift out of 5 into neutral, blip the throttle, then shift into 4th (or 3rd, depending on how quick I want to accelerate), and then accelerate.

To clarify: I'm talking about ACCELERATION, not DECELERATION, when I refer to double clutching.

I believe heel-and-toe is used more for road courses, when you are coming up to a turn, to allow you to BRAKE and DOWNSHIFT at the same time, so that you are already in gear ready to accelerate at the end of the turn

 

BTW, that link does a great job explaining what I was trying to describe.

But, just because our vehicles have synchronizers doesn't mean that you SHOULDN'T do it. Synchronizers can go bad over time, and I believe that this would help prolong them.

 

I see what you are saying about "accelerating", but I guess I'm not clear why you are going into neutral. Why can't you simply rev while downshifting? To save your synchros? I've been driving for 40 years and never remember any of my synchros going bad.

I just think if you rev match well enough, your synchros are safe - unless you're running at Monaco. Looking at it another way, going into neutral requires one extra clutch depression - wouldn't that make you worry about clutch wear?

 

Geez, I thought double-clutching meant pushing the clutch in twice!

 

Well, that's technically what you are doing...but you are going in to neutral in between.

 

That's the way my father taught me, and once you learn something particular on a manual, it's hard to change your ways.

But, I believe that it's to help with the synchronizers. I don't believe that just "blipping" the throttle with the clutch depressed has the same benefit, or at least as good of a benefit. I have tried both ways before (without shifting into neutral), and I think that it's easier to rev-match by shifting into neutral first, and I think the results are better too.

But, like I said, it's the way I was taught a long time ago, and it's just stuck.

With regard to the extra clutch depression: it really isn't bad for the clutch, because you aren't slipping it when shifting in to/out of neutral. Premature cltuch wear comes from excessive slippage, not pushing on the clutch when in neutral (although the throw out bearing may be a different story )

 

But I don't push the clutch in and out twice during each shift.

 

It's not for each shift...it's only for when you wish to downshift to do some rolling acceleration.

Prime example: you're cruising in 5th on a two-way road (at the posted speed limit, of course) when you come up to a slow car. You end up behind him, and he's going 10 under that posted speed limit. So, you wish to pass him. But, you want to do a quick pass, because you don't want to be driving James Bond style [read: in the left lane] for longer than needed.
There are now two choices for downshifting:

1) downshift "normally", which means go from 5th to 3rd, slip the clutch out, let the car "load up" to where-ever it's engine speed is for that gear, and then hit the gas.....
OR
2) double clutch from 5th to 3rd, which would prevent said "loading up" (that is the point of double clutching---rev-matching), and pass that slow driver.

Or, in your case, you can just turn on your lights if you're in the 89 to get the driver to move j/k

Also, double-clutching is a LOT smoother

 

I would never do the light thing on the '89! Now, maybe the siren?

As far as your example, I would:

3) Press in the clutch, shift to lower gear while blipping the engine to match RPMs (less for 4th, more for 3rd), let out the clutch while pressing the accelerator to the floor!

Since I'm rev-matched there is no clutch slipping, no stumble, no load... just power.

Unless this is the same as 2) and I don't know it.

I just don't know where the "double-clutch" part comes in... I only touch it once! I'm cornfused.

 

Yes, what you said does the same as what double-clutching does. The only difference is that with double clutching, you shift into neutral and blip the throttle (hence the name "double-clutching"...you push clutch once to go into neutral, release pedal & rev engine, then press clutch again to engage gear)

I already know what most of you are thinking...that this method is slow: while this may seem to be "slower" than Tom's method, it actually isn't. Like all driving methods of manuals, it just takes practice to learn how to do it right, and to do it fast.

Like I said before, your method and mine are very similar, and both pretty much accomplish the same thing. But, there are people that don't do either, and instead do what I described as "normal" downshifting (#1).

 

OK, The Double-Clutching is a bit off topic, but that's what is required when you don't have synchros and was used for years on semis. The synchros in the 2005+ Mustang can be out of mesh if you make a shift too quickly. So the "double-clutching" would solve that issue. The problem is only 3% of people driving outshift the synchros and it's people like John Force. Downshifting two gears and hammering the gas is going to load your driveline and eat your clutch over time. Matching revs and getting on it once everything is meshed is the best (two day driving school at RoadAmerica).

CLITNORIS...Get a TUNE! Just like getting your fuel pump fixed 6 months ago when the TSB told you there would be problems!!!

Back on topic... The Hurst (notch/retro feel) or Pro 5.0 (good and smooth) in conjunction with a good tune/ CAI will alleviate the majority of the "clunk" syndrome. Only when backing slowly up a small incline do I have drive lash and clunking now.

 

I think I'm good at it and mine is smooth shifting. I have forgotten what car I am in and hit the brake in my auto DD looking for a clutch lol.

my slow shift
http://videos.streetfire.net/search/...dcdf435458.htm

 

If I am about to make a turn, I find that it can be very difficult to downshift without rev matching or double clutching because the throttle doesn't want to blip. I have to floor the throttle because of the stupid drive by wire system.

 

EXACTLY...I have this same problem.

Also, I believe that this was the comment that started the whole thing about double clutching.

 

Yep. There are a few slow curves in low-traffic backstreets that I like to drive around and experiment with the manual gearbox. I find that if I maintain 4th or 5th gear in and out of the curve, I can downshift to 2nd gear more easily but I lost a lot of speed and time in the process. I'd like to be able to downshift into 3rd or 2nd before the turn and it isn't easily done without revmatching or double clutching.

I'm not talking about downshifting halfway through the turn, because that could mess with traction in slippery conditions.