I did my first auto-cross event over the weekend and I was wondering if there's any real benefit to adding a brake duct cooling kit to an auto-crossed vehicle. I know they're beneficial on a road racing vehicle because they reach higher speeds and for longer. But when auto-crossing, do you typically reach speeds that would make a brake cooling kit make any difference?

I was already thinking of getting one just for the heck of it and to make those lower corner spots in the front bumper functional, but I wasn't going to do it until later on. But if it would be beneficial to have for what will probably become a once a month thing for me now, I'll move it to the top of the list.

 

It can't hurt. I don't think there will be that much benefit @ auto-x speeds, but it certainly won't hurt. Do you have race pads or stock pads?

I run my car on road courses, and I wish I had a cooling kit, but haven't gotten around to it yet. I use Carbotech XP10 pads which are fade resistant to ~1500 F. I'm sure cooling ducts would help, but my setup does pretty well for now.

If you got the money and still running factory brake setup I think you'd get much more benefit from upgrading pads and brake fluid instead of the cooling to be honest. But if you already have upgraded hardware, then cooling is the next logical step.

 

You make a good point. I am stil running stock Brembo brake equipment, so maybe I'll look into the pads and fluid first. Thanks for the tip!

 

I love the Brembo setup on our cars, and how easy it is to swap front pads. I change mine out a week or two before the event, then swap back.

For Auto-X you could probably just do Hawk HP+ or something similar. Good pads will make all the difference in the world. I've been very happy with my setup. It handled 11 corners at Gingerman Raceway in Michigan for 30 min straight for 8 sessions. And only ate up 2mm of the pad material.

Ginegerman is notoriously tough on brakes and tires. There are some fast sections followed by 90 degree corners. The pads didn't overheat, and the pedal didn't get soft either. I left my rear pads stock.

I have a full weekend at Grattan Raceway coming up in less than 2 weeks. Using the same setup, but now also running Motul RBF600 brake fluid. I think that will work really well.

 

I haven't looked into what's involved with swapping brake pads on the Brembos. I take it it's really easy? And why do you swap the pads in and out a week before the race? Why not just leave the better pads in full time? Is it to get more life out of them?

 

Unless your autocross courses are big enough to get you up past 60 miles per hour for extended periods of time, my experience has been "no". The tires and suspension tuning to help turn-in, along with practice, make a bigger difference.

The fastest cars that get through an autocross course often use their brakes sparingly (quick stabs) in order to get the momentum of the car to carry it through the turns.

Take all of this with a grain of salt from someone who is a novice with a few years of races under the belt. A national level driver might say otherwise.

 

PS - the only things I ever changed out at autocross events in SCCA stock classes were tires. I used stock brakes and pads.

 

It is easy. You hammer out 2 pins, take the bracket out, and pads are free. Then swap, and put the pins and bracket back in. Done.

The reason I swap is because race pads have 2 major issues: (1) The noise is terrible. They squeak a LOT until they warm up. And (2) dust. I thought the Ferrodo pads in our Brembo setup dusted a lot. Race pads dust more. Plus they are more abrasive on the rotors, so continuous use would chew up the rotors quicker.

I'm sure you could find pads which handle Auto-x better but are still ok as a daily driver. For road courses though, that's like finding the unicorn.

P.S. What made you think that you need cooling? Did you experience any fade with the stock pads? Tony may have a point, perhaps for auto-x you're ok with the stock setup...?

 

Having only done one autocross event, I haven't experienced any brake fade yet and there certainly weren't any stretches where I got up to 60 probably at all, let alone for any length of time. Maybe in time I'll rely on the brakes less and less as I improve my skills. I just thought adding cooling for the brakes could only be a positive, or at least a neutral modification.

I would eventually like to get I to doing road courses as well, which I know would benefit greater from the brake cooling, but it'll be a little while before I can afford a couple/few hundred dollars for events.

I hate how much brake dust the stock Brembo brake pads give off. I was hoping to find some "high performance" pads that also reduce the amount of dust. I'm wondering if that's even a realistic wish. Maybe I'll have to go with dual sets of pads; one normal set that don't dust badly and one set I can use for autocross.

 

I would think with a set of grippy pads you would never need brake cooling on an auto-x course. It wouldn't be particularly effective anyways as the speeds you get up to wouldn't flow much air onto rotors

On road courses where corner speeds are ~50-60 on average and straight speeds are 125+, you get a lot of airflow through the ducting (granted, more heat during braking too...)

As others noted, it would not hurt, but I'd say just remove your dust shields front and rear, get some grippy pads like HP Plus for auto-x, and consider flushing fluid with RBF600 or something similar. SHould be more than enough!

And then get out to a road course and become addicted like me. I may have just bought myself a 2nd set of track wheels that are destined to be wrapped in Hoosier R6's in the near future...

 

Agree on the ease of swapping as well - super easy for the fronts. Bit more of a pain for the rears because the calipers have to be removed. Nut not bad

Also agree on noise and DUST. I have been driving with my track pads in recently as I don't put on many street miles between events, and holy dust. I can deal with the screaming pads, but the dust really is bad. And the rears wear really quickly on the street it seems. Not so bad for the fronts. I need to start switching after events, but between now and the end of Sept, I have ~3 weeks between outings and I only take the car out 2-3x per week otherwise. Between that and trailering to events, it's hard to justify the pad swapping... and oh how I love when I get a bit of heat in the pads on the street and the car suddenly stops RIGHT NOW

 

Ha, no wonder. With the amount of track days you attend in the summer you might as well just have track pads year round . But that's awesome, it means you get to drive the car the way it's meant to be driven a lot more often than me. I only have 1 or 2 weekends a year, so I can easily justify the time swapping.

And ditto to stopping RIGHT NOW. I have my Carbotech's on, and half way through my drive home from work today the bite really kicked in, lol. I'm now stopping 10 feet ago

 

Do you have a part number for the Carbotech pads. I'm thinking of switching pads out to a track pad. The stock Brembos did okay for how fast I was driving on the Ring. I'm sure that when I get faster I will need something with more bite. Stainless lines and fluid are going in too.

 

Yes sir. For the front 4-Piston Brembo the PN is CT1001. For the back it's the same pad for pretty much all mustangs, and the PN is CT1465. I use XP10 in the front, and I also got XP8 for the rear. But I haven't actually put them on. The stock rears seem to be holding ok so far. With how much brake dive the stock suspension allows the fronts do ~80% of the braking anyway. When they are gone I'll use the XP8s.

Here is the Carbotech site for part numbers too:
http://www.ctbrakes.com/pads.asp

TO OP:
I just noticed Carbotech has a compound specifically for AutoX. It's called AX6. You can read up on it here:
http://www.ctbrakes.com/brake-compounds.asp#1

 

That's awesome. Thanks for the info.