Inside line track comparo
6/25/12, 02:16 AM
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Inside line track comparo
Inside line took the GT500 and zl1 to the 'streets of willow' track. The GT500 turned the best lap, and by the numbers won most of the test conducted by this mag( some by a huge margin) The zl1 was still picked as the overall winner....
http://www.insideline.com/chevrolet/...ison-test.html
http://www.insideline.com/chevrolet/...ison-test.html
6/25/12, 06:21 AM
#2
Shelby GT500 Member
There is no other way to describe the article aside from heavily biased. The ZL1 is a track car--that LOST to a car with lesser suspension, chassis, etc., etc., on a track. I'm sorry, but if you're looking for a comfortable ride, then you need to compare the ZL1 to caddy's and lincolns. Simply put, these are performance cars, and if the ZL1 can't use its advantages over the GT500 to beat it around the track, no matter how buttery-smooth the ride is, it loses. Period. This also tells me that any kind of driver with decent skills will take the GT500 and smoke the ZL1. I'm curious why they didn't run a lap with the traction control for the GT500 on...they said it was slower, but they beat the ZL1 without it, and were in their words, busier behind the wheel. Let's see someone run the GT500 around that same track with the TC on; every review I've read thus far has had nothing but good things to say about how the Shelby's TC helps the car behave on the track.
Seriously, I'd look for GM-embossed stationery on the hard-copy of this review. If that's the best the ZL1 can do...well, I guess if you get your butt handed to you, you have to come up with some way to save face. Clearly, this is not an unbiased review, at all.
Seriously, I'd look for GM-embossed stationery on the hard-copy of this review. If that's the best the ZL1 can do...well, I guess if you get your butt handed to you, you have to come up with some way to save face. Clearly, this is not an unbiased review, at all.
6/25/12, 07:11 AM
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Copied from Inside Line: "I really don't have a horse in this race (no pun intended), but IL is not giving Ford enough credit for the amazing accomplishment here. After the last installment of this comparo, the implication was the Camaro's suspension was so superior it had to be faster on a track. I mean, IL gushed on-and-on about how wonderful the ZL-1 handled. And yet it turns out the ZL-1 is not faster after all, and so comes this statement . . .
"The fact that it was only about a half second off the Shelby's best time despite a huge power deficit speaks volumes."
Well that's one [biased?] way to look at it. But I think Mustang fans can make a legitimate argument that despite having what is a relatively crude live axle suspension and less tire, the GT-500 still manages to hook up well enough to out-track the far more sophisticated ZL-1. One lap or 100, shouldn't this shootout be about the best lap time? I guarantee you that if I'm a Ford engineer, I'm putting this one in the 'win' column."
"The fact that it was only about a half second off the Shelby's best time despite a huge power deficit speaks volumes."
Well that's one [biased?] way to look at it. But I think Mustang fans can make a legitimate argument that despite having what is a relatively crude live axle suspension and less tire, the GT-500 still manages to hook up well enough to out-track the far more sophisticated ZL-1. One lap or 100, shouldn't this shootout be about the best lap time? I guarantee you that if I'm a Ford engineer, I'm putting this one in the 'win' column."
6/25/12, 09:10 AM
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I think it came down to the old adage, "it's now how fast the car drives, but how well the car drives fast."
The GT500 certainly is THE numbers car, with some stupendous numbers at that, and if judged by spreadsheet alone, would be the obvious winner. However, some, though not all, judge a car outside these narrow parameters and in that broader assessment, a somewhat slower car can be the "better" drive.
Not that I'm a Camaro fan-boy by any means, but Chevy's doing a great job with it. Ford too, with a significantly older, less sophisticated chassis is doing great things too and are certainly maintaining a feverish competetive pace, quite in distinction to the "good enough" ethos of even just a couple years ago. What Ford's been able to do the past couple years bodes VERY well, IMHO, for what they will be able to do with the fresh 2015 Stang, which I predict will excel both quantitatively and qualitatively, i.e., it will drive just as well as it goes fast.
The GT500 certainly is THE numbers car, with some stupendous numbers at that, and if judged by spreadsheet alone, would be the obvious winner. However, some, though not all, judge a car outside these narrow parameters and in that broader assessment, a somewhat slower car can be the "better" drive.
Not that I'm a Camaro fan-boy by any means, but Chevy's doing a great job with it. Ford too, with a significantly older, less sophisticated chassis is doing great things too and are certainly maintaining a feverish competetive pace, quite in distinction to the "good enough" ethos of even just a couple years ago. What Ford's been able to do the past couple years bodes VERY well, IMHO, for what they will be able to do with the fresh 2015 Stang, which I predict will excel both quantitatively and qualitatively, i.e., it will drive just as well as it goes fast.
6/25/12, 09:48 AM
#6
Shelby GT500 Member
I'm quite certain I can drive the GT500 in such a way as to result in a pleasant ride. I don't really think that plays a part in how fast a car goes around a track. This smacks of the "everyone gets a trophy" philosophy so many people champion for kids who play sports: doesn't matter if you win, you get a trophy anyway because you're YOU!! Sorry, if you're running those cars on a track for timed runs, the ride during that timed run doesn't matter. Speed around the track matters. Yes, there's a place for comfort during a ride, but I hardly think the track is that place. If you don't run a faster time than the other guy, you lose. You can dress it up in any number of consolation prizes you want to, but even in that comparison, unquestionably biased in favor of the ZL1, the GT500 beat the camaro around the track. Nothing else needs to be said. I'll drive it comfortably when I'm on public roads.
6/25/12, 10:04 AM
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The main thing I see here and its been happening for years...mags usually pick the easier car to drive because they will push it more, the shelby makes you work so they are not as aggressive with it, for fear of going off the track. But thats what I like about it, the car makes you earn going fast. Many cars over the years have won by the numbers, but lose because they dont " ride as well" the way they downplay the GT500's performance is ridiculous at best, but I think it speaks volumes that the antiquated rear axle can keep up with the 3 evolution of the MRC super suspension. Its expected that the zl1 will win most mag reviewers choice, but the GT500 will be the better performing and best bang for the buck car....if I wanted a car that was pretty fast and powerful with a nice ride and ergonomics...I take a CTS-V all day long over a zl1
6/25/12, 11:18 AM
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This is the only Boss/ZL1 comparison I've seen. http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/...a/viewall.html
6/25/12, 12:01 PM
#10
Legacy TMS Member
Originally Posted by devious_stang
, but the GT500 will be the better performing and best bang for the buck car....
Saw two ZL1s at my local hot rod hang out and was further impressed with the two-piece front rotors (should had them on the rear as well but they didn't)
The roles are reversed once you get into the Boss and 1LE cars, there the Boss blows the 1LE out of the water for bang vs. buck and then again with the GT and the SS its the same with the Mustang offer better value.
Still good to see the GT500 beating up on the ZL1, can't wait for the Lightning Lap to see how things shake out there and would be really nice to see those two cars go head to head at the ring where the GT500 could make real use of its power.
6/25/12, 02:05 PM
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Maybe compared to a Porsche or GT-R but IMO given the content of the ZL1 I'd have to say best bang for the buck goes to the ZL1 when your talking top dawg pony cars despite the performance deficit. The ZL1 is practically a no-option car while the GT500 needs about 7k in options to match content.
Saw two ZL1s at my local hot rod hang out and was further impressed with the two-piece front rotors (should had them on the rear as well but they didn't)
The roles are reversed once you get into the Boss and 1LE cars, there the Boss blows the 1LE out of the water for bang vs. buck and then again with the GT and the SS its the same with the Mustang offer better value.
Still good to see the GT500 beating up on the ZL1, can't wait for the Lightning Lap to see how things shake out there and would be really nice to see those two cars go head to head at the ring where the GT500 could make real use of its power.
Saw two ZL1s at my local hot rod hang out and was further impressed with the two-piece front rotors (should had them on the rear as well but they didn't)
The roles are reversed once you get into the Boss and 1LE cars, there the Boss blows the 1LE out of the water for bang vs. buck and then again with the GT and the SS its the same with the Mustang offer better value.
Still good to see the GT500 beating up on the ZL1, can't wait for the Lightning Lap to see how things shake out there and would be really nice to see those two cars go head to head at the ring where the GT500 could make real use of its power.
on the contrary I believe the GT500 is better because you have the option of not having the things you dont deem necessary. The zl1 also doesnt offer recaro seats, nor does it offer a high tech electronics package with nav. I also dont see the 662HP option anywhere ( so 7k in options to match content is not true)...when we talk about what each offers thats really subjective. The Gt500 doesnt get slammed with a GG tax nor will you have to fill up as often. So I disagree the zl1 is best bang for buck, plus its uncomfortable to drive (no diff than a SS) and its ugly, JMO.
6/26/12, 07:02 AM
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Doesn't seem the GT500 can win no matter what it's capable of doing, it's not getting much love from some of these reviews.
It's so funny really. ALL the talk about the '13 was whether it could get the power down. No one cared about the 650+HP if it couldn't get the power to the ground. The early talk was all that HP was not going to be of any use against the superior handling ZL1.
And so when the GT500 blows away the ZL1 on the drag strip it's met with a shoulder shrug by these reviewers. When it beats the ZL1 on the track it's met with criticism.
The ZL1 is doing what everyone predicted it would do and it's praises are being sung from the roof tops.
The GT500 is doing what few thought it could do (get the power down and turn good numbers) and it's met with a "so what?"
GM has had years to develop this car, develop it so that the GT500 shouldn't stand a chance. However Ford sucker punched them with the '13 GT500. They sucker punched the auto mags too and I think these articles are how the mags are fighting back. They wanted the Shelby to lose it's place at the top and they must be gnashing their teeth that it hasn't happened.
It's so funny really. ALL the talk about the '13 was whether it could get the power down. No one cared about the 650+HP if it couldn't get the power to the ground. The early talk was all that HP was not going to be of any use against the superior handling ZL1.
And so when the GT500 blows away the ZL1 on the drag strip it's met with a shoulder shrug by these reviewers. When it beats the ZL1 on the track it's met with criticism.
The ZL1 is doing what everyone predicted it would do and it's praises are being sung from the roof tops.
The GT500 is doing what few thought it could do (get the power down and turn good numbers) and it's met with a "so what?"
GM has had years to develop this car, develop it so that the GT500 shouldn't stand a chance. However Ford sucker punched them with the '13 GT500. They sucker punched the auto mags too and I think these articles are how the mags are fighting back. They wanted the Shelby to lose it's place at the top and they must be gnashing their teeth that it hasn't happened.
6/26/12, 10:40 AM
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Doesn't seem the GT500 can win no matter what it's capable of doing, it's not getting much love from some of these reviews.
It's so funny really. ALL the talk about the '13 was whether it could get the power down. No one cared about the 650+HP if it couldn't get the power to the ground. The early talk was all that HP was not going to be of any use against the superior handling ZL1.
And so when the GT500 blows away the ZL1 on the drag strip it's met with a shoulder shrug by these reviewers. When it beats the ZL1 on the track it's met with criticism.
The ZL1 is doing what everyone predicted it would do and it's praises are being sung from the roof tops.
The GT500 is doing what few thought it could do (get the power down and turn good numbers) and it's met with a "so what?"
GM has had years to develop this car, develop it so that the GT500 shouldn't stand a chance. However Ford sucker punched them with the '13 GT500. They sucker punched the auto mags too and I think these articles are how the mags are fighting back. They wanted the Shelby to lose it's place at the top and they must be gnashing their teeth that it hasn't happened.
It's so funny really. ALL the talk about the '13 was whether it could get the power down. No one cared about the 650+HP if it couldn't get the power to the ground. The early talk was all that HP was not going to be of any use against the superior handling ZL1.
And so when the GT500 blows away the ZL1 on the drag strip it's met with a shoulder shrug by these reviewers. When it beats the ZL1 on the track it's met with criticism.
The ZL1 is doing what everyone predicted it would do and it's praises are being sung from the roof tops.
The GT500 is doing what few thought it could do (get the power down and turn good numbers) and it's met with a "so what?"
GM has had years to develop this car, develop it so that the GT500 shouldn't stand a chance. However Ford sucker punched them with the '13 GT500. They sucker punched the auto mags too and I think these articles are how the mags are fighting back. They wanted the Shelby to lose it's place at the top and they must be gnashing their teeth that it hasn't happened.
6/26/12, 12:27 PM
#16
Shelby GT500 Member
Doesn't seem the GT500 can win no matter what it's capable of doing, it's not getting much love from some of these reviews.
It's so funny really. ALL the talk about the '13 was whether it could get the power down. No one cared about the 650+HP if it couldn't get the power to the ground. The early talk was all that HP was not going to be of any use against the superior handling ZL1.
And so when the GT500 blows away the ZL1 on the drag strip it's met with a shoulder shrug by these reviewers. When it beats the ZL1 on the track it's met with criticism.
The ZL1 is doing what everyone predicted it would do and it's praises are being sung from the roof tops.
The GT500 is doing what few thought it could do (get the power down and turn good numbers) and it's met with a "so what?"
GM has had years to develop this car, develop it so that the GT500 shouldn't stand a chance. However Ford sucker punched them with the '13 GT500. They sucker punched the auto mags too and I think these articles are how the mags are fighting back. They wanted the Shelby to lose it's place at the top and they must be gnashing their teeth that it hasn't happened.
It's so funny really. ALL the talk about the '13 was whether it could get the power down. No one cared about the 650+HP if it couldn't get the power to the ground. The early talk was all that HP was not going to be of any use against the superior handling ZL1.
And so when the GT500 blows away the ZL1 on the drag strip it's met with a shoulder shrug by these reviewers. When it beats the ZL1 on the track it's met with criticism.
The ZL1 is doing what everyone predicted it would do and it's praises are being sung from the roof tops.
The GT500 is doing what few thought it could do (get the power down and turn good numbers) and it's met with a "so what?"
GM has had years to develop this car, develop it so that the GT500 shouldn't stand a chance. However Ford sucker punched them with the '13 GT500. They sucker punched the auto mags too and I think these articles are how the mags are fighting back. They wanted the Shelby to lose it's place at the top and they must be gnashing their teeth that it hasn't happened.
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