When you click on links to various merchants on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network.
I'm a firm believe that heat is a big issue, as well as larger electrical loads from modern electronics while at rest. What passes as a normal draw now, would have been a parasitic problem on older vehicles. AGM batteries exist to solve that issue, among other reasons.
I'm a Lincoln tech by trade, down here in swampy Florida. Anecdotally speaking, I think the trunk mount for the batteries works out better, based on what I see at work. The only wrinkle to that experience, is that the only modern Lincolns with trunk mounted batteries is the MKZ Hybrid, which is its own can of worms for electrical fun. But I'll say this, I replace so few 12v batteries in the hybrid version, that I forget about where the battery is until I open the hood. Our MKC/Escape vehicles have the battery mounted essentially under the windshield cowl, less than a foot from the valve cover, and maybe 2ft from the exhaust manifold. They absolutely eat batteries, versus vehicles with more cool air around the battery. Again, anecdotally speaking.
I'm a firm believe that heat is a big issue, as well as larger electrical loads from modern electronics while at rest. What passes as a normal draw now, would have been a parasitic problem on older vehicles. AGM batteries exist to solve that issue, among other reasons.
I'm a Lincoln tech by trade, down here in swampy Florida. Anecdotally speaking, I think the trunk mount for the batteries works out better, based on what I see at work. The only wrinkle to that experience, is that the only modern Lincolns with trunk mounted batteries is the MKZ Hybrid, which is its own can of worms for electrical fun. But I'll say this, I replace so few 12v batteries in the hybrid version, that I forget about where the battery is until I open the hood. Our MKC/Escape vehicles have the battery mounted essentially under the windshield cowl, less than a foot from the valve cover, and maybe 2ft from the exhaust manifold. They absolutely eat batteries, versus vehicles with more cool air around the battery. Again, anecdotally speaking.
My Mazda 3 had the battery mounted in pretty much the same area and it actually had a CAI on it. Battery is next to the drivers side strut tower. I wonder why this is something Mazda did and not Ford?
My Mazda 3 had the battery mounted in pretty much the same area and it actually had a CAI on it. Battery is next to the drivers side strut tower. I wonder why this is something Mazda did and not Ford?
Packaging. It's easy to put stuff over the transmission, so they did. My lil' Caliber is done just like that 3, battery over the transmission, CAI over that. As if that silly lil' motor needs a CAI.
As far as the S197 and S550, the battery was put where it was for weight distribution purposes. Placing it on the nose of the car pushes the weight forward to the front axle. Putting it behind the strut tower pushes the weight back, and helps balance the car for handling purposes, which then makes better reviews by the pundits like Autoweek, Motorweek, Motor Trend and such.
If heat is in fact the main reason for killing the lead acid batteries, how is it that AGM batteries are constructed any different when it comes to withstanding heat? I'd really like someone to explain this
If heat is in fact the main reason for killing the lead acid batteries, how is it that AGM batteries are constructed any different when it comes to withstanding heat? I'd really like someone to explain this
Not sure if the AGM will handle heat any better. On the JGC the battery is in the most ridiculous place, unless you are familiar with them you would never guess. It is under the front passenger set in a little battery well, covered with a plastic panel that is the color of the interior carpet. They may be place there to get away from the heat, but I do not know for sure.
There is one clear trend: Many of the highest-scoring are pricey absorbed glass mat (AGM) batteries, known for having a long service life and being able to tolerate deep discharges—when the battery has been significantly drained to 10.5 volts or below, such as when the lights are left on overnight.
“If you live in an area with extreme temperatures, and are looking for a maintenance-free battery, consider getting an AGM,” CR’s Banta says. “While AGM batteries can also be affected by high heat, they tend to perform better overall than other sealed batteries in our tests.”
He adds, “We have seen that most of the AGM batteries excel in our heat-focused life testing, based on 15 weeks of continuous testing at over 160 degrees. And the latest batch now being tested looks very promising.”
But even AGM batteries face challenges. “AGM batteries will perform well in the heat, but the life span will be hampered due to loss of water from the high temperatures,” says Jeff Barron, research lab manager for Interstate Batteries.
Barron explained that while some traditional batteries, known as “flooded,” can have their water replenished (with distilled water) to extend their service life, AGM batteries are sealed.
So I guess our best bet will be stick with our "Flooded" batteries and to check and top off the water levels frequently with distilled water? Sure the trickle charger does not hurt either as long as it does not boil out the water. I have been doing both of these things on the current battery. Maybe that is the key?
My OEM Ford battery lasted 4 years. Replaced it with an EverStart group size H6 battery and it lasted 2.5 years...garbage. I'm using the MotorMaster OEPLUS, 730 CCA, group size 48/H6 battery. Hope it will last longer. Also, using the Schumacher Automatic Maintainer onboard charger during the winter when not using the car often. OEPLUS batter and Schumacher charger. The blue wire is for Charging and the black wire is for the heater block.
Not sure if the AGM will handle heat any better. On the JGC the battery is in the most ridiculous place, unless you are familiar with them you would never guess. It is under the front passenger set in a little battery well, covered with a plastic panel that is the color of the interior carpet. They may be place there to get away from the heat, but I do not know for sure.
So I guess our best bet will be stick with our "Flooded" batteries and to check and top off the water levels frequently with distilled water? Sure the trickle charger does not hurt either as long as it does not boil out the water. I have been doing both of these things on the current battery. Maybe that is the key?
I've been running the battery minder plus trickle charger for well over 10 years.. Its sort of like the Deltran battery tender junior which has smart chip technology that automatically shuts off the unit when the battery is fully maintained/charged.. I've been very pleased with it and has never malfunctioned nor overcharged my batteries.. https://www.batteryminders.com/batte...er-desulfator/
My OEM Ford battery lasted 4 years. Replaced it with an EverStart group size H6 battery and it lasted 2.5 years...garbage. I'm using the MotorMaster OEPLUS, 730 CCA, group size 48/H6 battery. Hope it will last longer. Also, using the Schumacher Automatic Maintainer onboard charger during the winter when not using the car often.
OEPLUS batter and Schumacher charger. The blue wire is for Charging and the black wire is for the heater block.
Yup your EverStart battery experience is pretty much what mine has been too.
So in your plug-in pic is the vent next to it in your lower grill for brake cooling?
If heat is in fact the main reason for killing the lead acid batteries, how is it that AGM batteries are constructed any different when it comes to withstanding heat? I'd really like someone to explain this
I don't believe AGM batteries are designed to handle heat any differently than a flooded type. The main draw to AGM is they have a longer discharge ability, as they are more energy dense. They can also be lighter than flooded batteries, and are considered "sealed" or "maintenance free." They are just a progression of battery tech. I will say, they are much more finnicky about charging. They charge up very slowly, compared to a flooded battery. For that reason, I run into a lot of battery related concerns from customers who drive short distances regularly. Concerns including features turning off, and other battery "state of charge" preservation things, most of the time the cars continue to start and run like normal.
Originally Posted by Siber Express
My Mazda 3 had the battery mounted in pretty much the same area and it actually had a CAI on it. Battery is next to the drivers side strut tower. I wonder why this is something Mazda did and not Ford?
That's a common battery placement for a FWD application. Due to engine layout, it creates different places to bolt in the battery. Almost all FWD cars have a variety of that setup, just due to being able to package everything well.
I don't believe AGM batteries are designed to handle heat any differently than a flooded type. The main draw to AGM is they have a longer discharge ability, as they are more energy dense. They can also be lighter than flooded batteries, and are considered "sealed" or "maintenance free." They are just a progression of battery tech. I will say, they are much more finnicky about charging. They charge up very slowly, compared to a flooded battery. For that reason, I run into a lot of battery related concerns from customers who drive short distances regularly. Concerns including features turning off, and other battery "state of charge" preservation things, most of the time the cars continue to start and run like normal.
That's a common battery placement for a FWD application. Due to engine layout, it creates different places to bolt in the battery. Almost all FWD cars have a variety of that setup, just due to being able to package everything well.
I really appreciate you taking the time to fully explain both the pros and cons of an AGM battery vs standard/flooded types.. After thoroughly reading over your post response, I've come to the conclusion that the cons over making the switch to an AGM battery from a standard/flooded type far outweigh the pros in my honest opinion.. Despite having larger discharge abilities, as they are more energy dense just as you just mentioned, however, does the larger discharge ability actually provide a significant difference over a standard/flooded battery which also takes much less time to charge up? Unless the AGM batteries have significant more energy and significantly larger discharge abilities over a standard/flooded battery, I really don't see much of an advantage in making the switch, to be honest with you..
Perhaps, I'm dead wrong about all this, but that's pretty much how I interpreted your description of the pros and cons between AGM versus acid/flooded batteries
Last edited by m05fastbackGT; 4/28/22 at 04:32 PM.
So I stumbled across this article today. Not sure of this author's knowledge or background, but according to John Paul, "The Car Doctor" from the Providence Journal, it is not a great idea to put an AGM in a car designed for a Lead Acid Battery... See the 4th Q&A.
Q: Can you comment on the advisability of installing an AGM (advanced glass mat) battery in a vehicle that was originally equipped with a conventional lead-acid battery? Perhaps there are differences in the vehicle charging system or electronic controls of the system that would lead to incompatibility?
A: Substituting an AGM battery for a lead-acid battery can get a little controversial.
At AAA, we believe that you should stay with the same type and design of battery that your vehicle came with. The reasoning is the charging system was designed for a certain design battery, and that is the battery that should be used in the car.
Some battery retailers will show good, better, and best batteries and list the AGM replacement as the “best” battery.
Until vehicle manufacturers approve upfitting to a different battery, I would use AGM batteries in vehicles that came with AGM batteries and lead-acid batteries in vehicles that came with lead-acid batteries.
Battery completed dead after just 2 years! Same thing happened to my wife's Edge after 2 year. Does Ford install crappy batteries or what!
Luckily I had AAA and they quickly came and replaced the battery for me. If I wasn't on vacation 200 miles away from home then perhaps I could've replaced the battery myself. Turns out AAA was cheaper anyhow, who knew...
The battery in my '03 Explorer ran for 10 years before dying (in a Wal-Mart parking lot, so I was able to just go back in and buy a battery, hah!) But that vehicle was a daily driver that got a very consistent 45-60 minutes of driving a day on just two starts so the battery was very, very well maintained.
If you are in a situation where you don't regularly drive or drive only short distances, a battery tender is your friend. My 13GT, which is not a daily driver, has one on all the time because it only gets out on the road once every week or two during the summer and gets parked for ~4-5 months a year.
I really appreciate you taking the time to fully explain both the pros and cons of an AGM battery vs standard/flooded types.. After thoroughly reading over your post response, I've come to the conclusion that the cons over making the switch to an AGM battery from a standard/flooded type far outweigh the pros in my honest opinion.. Despite having larger discharge abilities, as they are more energy dense just as you just mentioned, however, does the larger discharge ability actually provide a significant difference over a standard/flooded battery which also takes much less time to charge up? Unless the AGM batteries have significant more energy and significantly larger discharge abilities over a standard/flooded battery, I really don't see much of an advantage in making the switch, to be honest with you..
Perhaps, I'm dead wrong about all this, but that's pretty much how I interpreted your description of the pros and cons between AGM versus acid/flooded batteries
I'm sorry this reply is 6 weeks late, but hopefully you'll see it.
In my opinion, there is no benefit to putting an AGM battery in a vehicle that came with a conventional style battery from the factory. The draw of AGM is that it has that longer discharge capability, which goes hand in hand with the increased resting draw of the modern electrical systems. On an older vehicle, or one that was designed with a conventional battery in mind, the biggest thing you might notice is that the car can sit a little longer between starts during storage without needing a jumpstart. It's best to just stick with what the vehicle was designed to use from the factory.
Anecdotally speaking, I put an AGM battery in one of my motorcycles that took a conventional battery from the factory. This bike has a high compression, 1000cc Vtwin engine, it's not nice to the battery trying to crank this thing over on anything less than full charge. Anyway, at the time, I was riding it 12 miles per day, round trip, to work and back. Due to the slow charging ability of the AGM style, high compression engine, and meager motorcycle charging system, for 2 years I had to throw the bike on a charger anytime the weather got under 65 degrees. After I finally got tired of that, I chucked a regular battery back in the bike. I now ride the thing on a 4 mile round trip, like twice a week at this point, and it still cranks faster than it did for the majority of the time it had an AGM in it. Plus it's cheaper. Made me a believer first hand!
Thank you for your reply and for also confirming my suspicions regarding the cons of having no real benefit to installing an AGM battery in a vehicle which was originally designed for a conventional style battery from the factory
Thanks for the reply and adding to the thread! Yes it seems like it is best to stick to batteries that our cars were designed to operate with. Conventional batteries are less $$$ and the AGM will likely not add additional life.
4/20/22, 04:45 PM
