2011+ Base Mustang Engine Choices.
3/18/08, 10:23 AM
#21
Team Mustang Source
Thread Starter
Since I keep mentioning the exhaust note of older V6 Alfa Romeo's I though I would go ahead and post a link that would let those curious hear what such a thing sounds like. It's a short clip, but it gives a good indication of what a stock (or close to it) Alfa V6 sounds like when given the juice. Very, very nice stuff.
http://www.youtube.com
http://www.youtube.com
3/18/08, 10:46 AM
#22
Legacy TMS Member
Despite what people are saying about Mazda, they are the only ones in the sub 30k market with this technology. Go test drive a Speed6, Speed3 or a CX-7 and see for yourself why this engine has been on Ward's list every year that it has been for sale.
258-280hp from a 2.3 liter engine. That's more than 100hp per liter.
I will grant you that the sound of it doesn't compare to a big V8, but you'll be hard pressed to catch them to argue that point.
258-280hp from a 2.3 liter engine. That's more than 100hp per liter.
I will grant you that the sound of it doesn't compare to a big V8, but you'll be hard pressed to catch them to argue that point.
3/18/08, 12:18 PM
#24
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Since I keep mentioning the exhaust note of older V6 Alfa Romeo's I though I would go ahead and post a link that would let those curious hear what such a thing sounds like. It's a short clip, but it gives a good indication of what a stock (or close to it) Alfa V6 sounds like when given the juice. Very, very nice stuff.
http://www.youtube.com
http://www.youtube.com
3/18/08, 03:02 PM
#27
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Are you still here? So Ford is going to lose a lot of sales if they consider making the base six cylinder Mustang, a model which has existed more or less since the initial 1965 model, a better performance car and not simply the sub GT place holder that it now is? Riiiggghht.
V-6 enignes will never be able to duplicate the power of V-8(s), especially with the same tricks placed on the V-8(s).
More folks buying V-6 Mustangs than V-8(s) ... Never happened in 65-73. I know I won't be buying one, and I'll stop giving Ford my business if they drop the V-8 again, I dont care what the consequences are. If Ford screws up another Mustang (like they did the BULLITT and the last T-bird) I'll go somewhere else, even if it is just to cause Ford to lose my business. They are going to build what I want or they can build for someone else.
3/18/08, 04:10 PM
#29
Team Mustang Source
Thread Starter
I think your source is mistaken. The reality is that, while Mazda isn't a wholly owned subsidiary, it is run that way. The only caveat in their agreement is that they have to at least give the appearance of a partially autonomous Mazda. If Ford wanted the Mazda GTDi, they don't have to ask.
3/18/08, 04:18 PM
#30
Team Mustang Source
Thread Starter
Originally Posted by TXBLUOVAL
V-6 enignes will never be able to duplicate the power of V-8(s), especially with the same tricks placed on the V-8(s).
Originally Posted by TXBLUOVAL
I know I won't be buying one, and I'll stop giving Ford my business if they drop the V-8 again,
Last edited by jsaylor; 3/18/08 at 04:27 PM.
3/18/08, 05:58 PM
#31
As I stated above, the Mazda turbo 4 GDI vibrates and sounds like a sewing machine with a broken gear. Performance was OK once it got wound up, but was not all that impressive.
3/18/08, 06:47 PM
#32
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3/18/08, 08:20 PM
#34
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3/18/08, 08:21 PM
#35
Cobra R Member
V6 or V8, I'll take either as long as it's done well.
I remember when I raced my cousin's '86 Buick Grand National with my '88 Mustang GT, a while back, and he smoked me so bad I thought I was going backwards.
I remember when I raced my cousin's '86 Buick Grand National with my '88 Mustang GT, a while back, and he smoked me so bad I thought I was going backwards.
3/18/08, 09:04 PM
#36
Team Mustang Source
Thread Starter
With the MZR GTDi we have a power-plant that offers no serious increase in power over a 3.5L V6 which employs an amazingly small amount of techno gizmos and no advantage in fuel economy either despite being in a smaller, lighter car. Also worth mentioning is that the Mazda needs premium to hit those numbers, the 3.5L uses regular. By this point it is no secret that Ford was and is seriously disappointed in the performance of both Mazda's and Volvo's low pressure turbo programs, which is why they are developing their own. Ford wants a GTDi four that produces beating mpg and 280 or so hp on regular unleaded in a 2.0L package. The MZR isn't even close to accomplishing that, and neither are Volvo's newest mills.
The other issue with Mazda 'not allowing' Ford to use 'their' GTDi engine is that Ford doesn't have to ask. Mazda may not yet be a wholly owned subsidiary of FoMoCo but it is run that way, and both the Bank of Hiroshima and the Japanese govt would do almost anything to keep it that way. The only stipulation is that Ford has to at least give the appearance of some autonomy within the Mazda brand.
,
Last edited by jsaylor; 3/18/08 at 09:06 PM.
3/18/08, 09:05 PM
#37
I Have No Life
3/18/08, 09:12 PM
#38
Team Mustang Source
Thread Starter
You don't think there remains the possibility that a GTDi V6 will still sneak in between the base model and V8?
My only worry is that 3.5L might be too much displacement to create a V6 that sounds that sweet. The sweet spot for V6 engines seems to top out at about 3.2L, which is by chance exactly where the Alfa 196's engine sits, with anything above that typically taking on some unfortunate harmonic side effects. Take Nissan's 3.5L plus VQ series engines for example. Forum member Q'Res and I have discussed once or twice that this engine is loved and lauded in every respect but one, they sound like crap.
Originally Posted by rhumb
Or I might suggest this clip -- www.youtube.com -- as I think it gives bit better sound (and notice what a thing of mechanical beauty that Alfa motor is).
My only worry is that 3.5L might be too much displacement to create a V6 that sounds that sweet. The sweet spot for V6 engines seems to top out at about 3.2L, which is by chance exactly where the Alfa 196's engine sits, with anything above that typically taking on some unfortunate harmonic side effects. Take Nissan's 3.5L plus VQ series engines for example. Forum member Q'Res and I have discussed once or twice that this engine is loved and lauded in every respect but one, they sound like crap.
Last edited by jsaylor; 3/18/08 at 09:19 PM.
3/18/08, 09:18 PM
#39
I Have No Life
You don't think there remains the possibility that a GTDi V6 will still sneak in between the base model and V6?
My only worry is that 3.5L might be too much displacement to create a V6 that sounds that sweet. The sweet spot for V6 engines seems to top out at about 3.2L, which is by chance exactly where the Alfa 196's engine sits, with anything above that typically taking on some unfortunate harmonic side effects. Take Nissan's 3.5L plus VQ series engines for example. Forum member Q'Res and I have discussed once or twice that this engine is loved and lauded in every respect but one, they sound like crap.
My only worry is that 3.5L might be too much displacement to create a V6 that sounds that sweet. The sweet spot for V6 engines seems to top out at about 3.2L, which is by chance exactly where the Alfa 196's engine sits, with anything above that typically taking on some unfortunate harmonic side effects. Take Nissan's 3.5L plus VQ series engines for example. Forum member Q'Res and I have discussed once or twice that this engine is loved and lauded in every respect but one, they sound like crap.
But yeah, I wouldn't doubt we'll see it at some point in there.
3/18/08, 09:41 PM
#40
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My brother's 350Z sounds really nice. The 3.7L VQ in the Infiniti also sounds great too. Not sure why you say they sound like crap!
Last edited by max2000jp; 3/18/08 at 09:44 PM.