Gash05

Why exactly do I need a tune for the C&L intake kit? I know everyone says it's required, but why exactly? Just curious...

Hambone

Okay, I'll give a layman's description, since it's the best I can do

Simply put---too much air, not enough fuel!! Your car won't run right, and you'll likely damage the engine.

Normally, the computer in your car adjusts fuel flow to the engine so that the air to fuel ratio is constant--and safe--for your engine. Too much fuel, it runs rich; too little fuel, it runs lean. So, the computer keeps it "right."

When you add an intake like the C&L, SOOOO much more air flows into the engine that the stock programming in your computer can't adjust the fuel to keep up. So, the engine will either run lean--which can make the pistons too hot and cause damage. or the computer may simply "give up" and revert to a "safe mode" condition. This will result in engine error codes (check engine light will turn on, etc.).

This is where the tuner comes in! When you get a tuner, it contains a new program for your car's computer that can adjust for the new air intake you are using. The neat part is that with a good tune you get MUCH more than just the right air/fuel mix. You get improvements on the throttle control/delay, improvements in shift points (in an auto), in torque converter control, etc. etc. It's really impressive what a good tune will do for our cars!!

So---if you put the C&L on without a matching tune, the computer in your 'stang will say 'Woah! Way too much air!", light your Check Engine Light, and go into Fail Safe Mode. It won't even idle right!! So, you really should NOT do it.

The installation sheet of the C&L intake tells you this right up front---you'll need a tune, and don't use it without one!

It's sound advice

scrming

Here's a little more info...

The car's computer calculates how much air is coming into the engine by using the MAF (Mass Air Flow sensor). To calculate the volume of air it has to use the size of the MAF housing. Change the size of the MAF housing and you throw off the calculation. So if you make the MAF housing larger you will get MORE air. But the computer is still calculating the air voume based on the stock MAF housing size. As a result the engine is getting more air then the computer has calculated. The computer gives the car the amount of fuel it has erroronously calculated... which is to little fuel.. causing the car to go lean...as described by Ham...

Now the CAI kits that claim no tune required tend to increase the MAF housing just slightly, causing the car to lean out enough to give you a power increase with out leaning it to much to cause problems... While this may be safe for you car I personally don't like the idea and as such tend to recommend you get a good tune with any CAI kit..

Now in the C&L case the new MAF housing is SOOOO BIG that the air volume calcuation will be far off the car would be dangerously lean. When we tune my car we had to add a huge amount of fuel to compensate..

To give you an idea... here is the stock MAF housing vs the C&L...

Doug@C&L

From a tuning standpoint...

They are correct, I add as much as 30% of fuel to the top end at WOT but the biggest adjustments are down low around idle and part throttle where you have to add 15% at one point and 20% in others, for the C&L. Actually the C&L kit uses the same MAF housing as they use for the GT kit.


Now as for NO Tuning required MAF's the idea is to actually make the intake pipe smoother and prettier but in order to keep the a/f as close to stock parameters they actually have to make the MAF housing smaller then factory. This keeps the output close to the same from the MAF readings. ON most No tuning required kits I've found that they actually go richer then stock, with the exception of the MMR kit.

The thing that isn't so good about this is stock is around 12.2:1, most NTR kits end up at 11.5-11.8:1 like with the AEM kit I just did. Where this isn't bad for your engine the a/f ratio isn't the best for making power. I made 2-4rwhp more with my tuning just by raising the a/f to around 12.8:1.

IN MY OPINION if the air intake doesn't require a tune then it doesn't add much if any HP. Think about it, how do you keep the output readings the same and make more HP?

Thanks, Doug.

05 cayuse

You guys are great! what excellent expanations. That's why us newbies eat up the posts on this forum. My knowledge of this car's potential has gone from 0-60 in two months. A BIG thanks from the peanut gallery!

Burke0011

Yeah, great info.

And Doug is the man - that's why his Bamachips sticker is in my engine bay and his tune in my car.

(still roadtesting that new 93 'automagic' torque tune you sent me ) :drive:

scrming

Engine bay??? No, Lidio is Da Man... that why I have his Alternative auto sticker on my windshield... proudly displayed for every one to see!!! And before anyone asks... No, Lidio did not ask me to put it on... I insisted we put the window banner on... no strings attached! LOL!

(Zodiac know's I can't resist a shameless plug!!! LOL!)

hamidlmt

Just for kicks, I flashed back to stock with the C&L intake installed and tried starting her up. That was not a happy car and it barely started. Went back to Bamachips' torque tune very, very quickly!

Doug.... what's this automagic torque tune that Burke0011 mentioned?!!

Gash05

thanks a BUNCH for the info guys...this got me thinking, since our cars respond pretty well to an aftermarket intake and tune...wouldn't it make sense that adding a ported upper and lower intake manifold would make even more power? I know it would add HP some since it's ported and all, but our cars respond so well to modifcations that I think the ported and polished intakes should be next on a lot of peoples' list!

go here: http://www.supersixmotorsports.com/PDF/SSM...CatalogVer2.pdf

I know it's been posted but go to the second page and really look at the products they offer. I'm going to build my girlfriend's motor (2003 3.8L) with SSM's products and I'm hoping my funds are efficient enough to be keeping along side her, mod for mod. I'd really love to see what some motor building can do on the 4.0L. Anyone else going the same route? I plan on doing all the motor mods before I turbo my car, so once it's all done I'll have full-fledged beast in my driveway.

Excepcion13

I hear ya, brother! Taking my mods in stages. I think that these are the kind of mods that I am looking for, too. With LTs, Prochamber, and duals, I want all of the air I can get before I add whatever poweradder i finally decide on.

Gash05

remember, with longtubes you can't get the turbo kit offered by PowerHouse411...not too sure about other kits but I've been told that most kits come with either custom fabricated headers or require shorties...

Burke0011

Hey bro to each his own.
I have plenty of cool stickers and such that would look great on the car..... but its a personal thing - I don't STICK anything on my cars (I didn't on my previous and that was an Escort ZX2) - only static window vinyls.... and expecially with my Stang. The DK II stays dark and clean.......

Vinyl..... CRAP! - I gotta order my Source vinyl window logo - knew I was forgetting something....

MaverickMLFD371

I never got any BamaChips stickers... Doug u got any stickers u can mail me?