Hey guys,

I'm headed out the door this morning as I have a few to go dyno here local. I will post the others when I get back and have sometime.

I'm going to start this thread with Sodaman's results in my runview software as well as posting the actual Dynojet Runviewer Files for download. You can download the Runviewer Software free from www.dynojet.com and view them yourself and change the way it is read from MPH to RPM. You will then verify that you cannot change any numbers so this will end this arguement before it starts.

Sodaman's runs, 2 and 4 which is the best tuned BamaChips run(run2) as compared to his best STOCK w/CAI run(run4). The overall numbers from the stock run CANNOT BE COMPARED from the run 4 because as you will all see the converter lock/unlock spike at 4800 rpm's but you can compare the HP and TQ differences across the range.

Thanks, Doug.

http://users.wildblue.net/bamachips/RunFile_001.drf

http://users.wildblue.net/bamachips/RunFile_002.drf

http://users.wildblue.net/bamachips/RunFile_003.drf

http://users.wildblue.net/bamachips/RunFile_004.drf

 

Also, the reason I had to start the stock run at 4000 rpm's is because everytime I tried to goto WOT it would downshift into 3rd gear below 4000 rpm's.

 

Thanks for the info Doug, greatly appreciated.

Now if somebody would post the same info for Mitch's (MTCHSTNG) and Mark's (One Mean Marine) pulls maybe we can put this subject to rest for awhile.

 

I have theirs too but I'm running short on time...I maybe able to get them up before I leave..

 

Doug if you could post mine that is great since I havent been able to.
still loving the tune btw......

Mitch

 

Here's Mitch's, his is the one that hit 12.5 at one point and then went to 14+...Run 001 was his stock run with an intake and run 8 was his intake and BC tune.

We were comparing it to another pull when we made the last one but it put it under a different folder and made it run 008, it's actually run 5 and you can download the file and compare the time it was made to prove this. I would have changed it but as you'll see once a run is made you cannot make any changes to the same of the Run or most anything else.

http://users.wildblue.net/bamachips/...unFile_001.drf

http://users.wildblue.net/bamachips/...unFile_002.drf

http://users.wildblue.net/bamachips/...unFile_003.drf

http://users.wildblue.net/bamachips/...unFile_004.drf

http://users.wildblue.net/bamachips/...unFile_008.drf

 

Also, the reason the numbers are so close uptop was he didn't have a good tank of 91/93 but rather 87 and 93 so when it would get into the higher RPM's it would pull timing as noted on the Datalogs. With a good tank of 93 his graphs would have kept climbing.

 

This is OneMeanMarine's or Mark's runs.This was one we made a baseline pull with his stock intake, run001, then his intake 002 and then my tune, stock Ford MAF and 87 tune because all he has was 87 and he knew it. Still, he made a nice gain over stock with the 87 tune, good A/F and CAI.

I'll post the rest later...

http://users.wildblue.net/bamachips/...unFile_001.drf

http://users.wildblue.net/bamachips/...unFile_002.drf

http://users.wildblue.net/bamachips/...unFile_003.drf

http://users.wildblue.net/bamachips/...unFile_004.drf

http://users.wildblue.net/bamachips/...unFile_005.drf

 

I don't understand why these all look jacked up, why is there like a loop de loop in the middle of the graphs, I've never seen that before. I also don't see how it's even possible to have a flatline a/f ratio while actually doing a dyno-run, that one graph shows a flat line going all the way across, is it possible that was actually an idle a/f that got mixed up?

 

The loop de loop is the torque converter unlocking and relocking. Unless the dyno operator locks it down with a flasher, that's what it looks like.

As for the flat line, several possible reasons but there is no way they can get mixed up. All the info is is one file.

Doug, thanks again.

 

OK, I see where Doug says that is happening, but I still don't understand why. You say the dyno operator locks it down with a flasher, is that a tune only thing? I'm just trying to understand what's going on, that's the first time I've seen that.

 

It's what the stock ECM is programed to do. IIRC It can be removed with a Ford Scan tool or Doug says it can be done with SCT.

http://forums.bradbarnett.net/showpo...87&postcount=5


Why Doug chose not to with these runs, you would have to ask him.


Addtional....

The reason it looks so weird is that the bottom axis is RPM. When the converter unlocks and them relocks you get a quick drop in RPM and the plot moves backwards. As the rpm rise, it moves forward again. If you change the bottom axis from RPM to Time it looks like this.

 

I get what the graph is showing now, but like on the first dyno graph for sodaman, with the GMS base run, definitely see the lock/unlock thing, but not on the run after the tune. Is it the tune that locks the converter? Is this second run that doesn't show any unlocking set up differently? Is the converter locked in that run? Also, I take it not every car will lock or unlock at same time or something? I'm just trying to find out why my dyno graph doesn't have a spike like that, did they do something to the dyno or my car?

 

They were probably aware of what was going on with the Automatics and locked down your tranny so they could do your pull.

 

I may get yelled at for this but comparing all three stock GMS pulls, it looks to me that sodaman's (004) A/F plot is nowhere similar to the other two, I would consider that to be suspect, in that there may have been something outside the norm on that pull that caused a misread by the probe. JMHO.

 

I have one more question, and then I'll stop posting on this or any of the other threads. I have gotten my car dynod and everything looked good a/f wise, and using 88 octane my final hp/torque numbers match comparably. Some people are going to believe what they want, and regardless of what some other people have expressed as opinions, or tried to show in regards to how the GMS CAI works, nothing has been shown yet to prove to me that my CAI is not doing what it says it is.

I admit that some of my posts may have come across strongly, but it is my stubborness and hard-headedness that prevails, and if I have offened anyone I do apologize as that was not my intent. I will never understand why some people have such a huge hangup about this product, and my only conclusion is that it must be seen as a threat, since I have verified that MY CAI works rather well. I believe the only way people will stop making claims and bashing this product is if and when actual GMS users start getting their car dynod and posting their results. Unfortunately, here we are 3 months later and mine is the only one I see, so it seems a lot of GMS users are starting to doubt their CAI's capabilities, but no one wants to be the one to try and disprove it.

My question is to Doug. When the cars were reverted back to stock tune, and the GMS CAI and it's supplied MAF and harness were installed back on, was the battery cable disconnected on every car tested as per GMS instructions, and if not, could you please explain why.

 

This is the base stock file information. It mainly shows that without a tune there are very many different configurations that the a/f can take. I've seen them goto 5500 rpm's and then drop like a rock, the a/f that is, because of the cat temp sensors. Each UNTUNED run may have a differenet a/f ratio.

Now, on my tunes the reason the a/f is at a perfect flat line is because I commaned the PCM to go into Open loop when the TPS reaches a certain parameter. As you'll see on some stock runs sometimes it does go instantly but other times it goes into Open loop slowly, hence the drop off. There are TPS position delays and even time delays in the stock programming, this is mainly for emission reasons. On a supercharged car this can be a very bad thing in that it may goto WOT and not be in Open loop and then have a dangerous a/f ratio for a small amount of time.

The probe was never moved in any of the tests, it was always taken from the driver's exhaust tip and was securely attached.

When the cars are returned to stock using the SCT X-calibrator it will clear the Keep-Alive memory on the PCM. This will cause the P1000 code. This is the same thing as removing the battery cable for a period of time as doing so will give you the same code.

If you need me to go into detail on the converter spike as it is called then just let me know. All Automatic cars do it, if you put the dynoruns over MPH instead of RPM you'll get a bump instead of a Loop-de-loop but it does the same thing. On a naturally aspirated car it does it around 4800-5000 rpm's, on a S/C car it can do it as low as 4100-4200 rpms due to the increased power.

In my tunes I lock the converter fully and command this in the software and this is why my tunes don't allow for this spike. This is the proper way to do it. You MUST use a tuner of sometype to do this, the dyno operator cannot do this without one. There is one way around it and that is to dyno the car in a lower gear, such as 3rd, but the numbers maybe a bit off but not much. Still it is best to do your dyno pulls in 4th which is the 1-1 gear.

Thanks for keeping this post cival, this is the right format to ask questions

Thanks, Doug.

 

I don't think you will ever stop and Doug owes you nothing so I hope he does not respond.

 

Thanks.

 

OMG I've turned into ski!!!