xetrov

Ok I got my parts in yesterday, and installed the CAI....i'll wait to install the H-Pipe until I get the Loudmouths in. The install went well and the tune was even easier. Now, my reason for posting...should I feel a huge increase in power? I was also hoping it and the tune would take care of that dead spot when launching where it seems to bog down just a bit, then explode with power. Maybe I should reserve judgement until i get the exhaust on?

tom281

Hopefully this isn't another case of a lack of response from a JLT II kit and X2 tune. I have the same setup and dyno runs have proven, atleast on my car, to not be what I expected. That's even with 3 or so hours of nonstop dyno tuning.

I don't mean to discourage you, just stating the facts in my experience with my car and those same parts. And I would doubt that the car will make noticeably more power with the H pipe; most people that have installed theirs claim to lose a little bit of power (torque) down low. Peak numbers may be up, but I don't think you'll notice it off the line.

Good luck,

tom281

xetrov

Another? Is this a known issue or something i managed to miss?

tom281

I can't speak for anyone besides myself. Basically long story short, here's my experience with the JLT II kit and X2 combo:

-paid almost $600 bucks for the combo

-installed it and paid $150 bucks for a dyno reading that read 276/306 at the wheels

-thought that number sounded low (the car is a manual) after reading this combo would add 25+ hp, so made an appointment with the company that sold the combo to have it dyno tuned.

-after several pulls, best run of the day was 279 / 301. However, the 279 peak number was at 6200 rpm. At 6100 rpm the power was 263 and at 6300 rpm the power was 254. Talk about a narrow powerband....had big spikes like this at the topend of the runs.


-after that pull, reinstalled the factory airbox and tune: got 266 / 293.

-the tuner was unable to pinpoint why I had the spike at the top of the power curve. Also note that this was a 93 octane tune using 93 octane fuel. The car would make the same power when a 87 octane tune was loaded, so it was like it wasn't responding to any additional timing.

There were points in the rpm range were the JLTII and X2 was 5 to 7 horse higher than stock, but again if you rule out that spike the peak horse numbers were down and torque was up slightly.

-Dyno tune fee for all of this: almost $400

So, in my case, with my car and those parts on a dyno with professional dyno tuning, I've paid a grand to find out that I'm only slightly, slightly more powerful than the stock setup, and only in certain rpm ranges. I do have better throttle response though.... :scratch:

Lastly, I have tried a different tune from a different tuner on the X2 and it seems improved; however I haven't justified spending another $150 in dyno time to see if it actually is better, or isn't.

I hope you don't have the same experience as me; every car is different and you don't know what you'll actually get for your investment until its installed and tested.

tom281

tom281

Forgot one thing: to be fair, the $400 for dyno time included installing a bung on my H pipe to have a/f monitored. Overall, I think that I got an awesome deal on the dyno tuning price, just not happy with the results.

Trampus

279 sounds about right at the wheels to me. Assuming that there is 16% power loss in the drivetrain, that would put your power at 332 at the crank.

I have the original JLT with X2 and I'm very happy with it. Sorry to hear that it did live up to your expectations.

tom281

I would be happy with 279 too, if it was for more than 100 rpm. It's impossible to say that my true power is that high when it appears at that small of increment, then drops off by over 10 horse before or after. Ruling out that one spike, the parts actually lost hp compared to stock.

Anyway, to get this thread back on track, hopefully xetrov will have better performance with his kit. I'm not trying to degrade anyone's parts, tunes, etc. Just pointing out real facts that I've learned the hard way with dyno charts to prove it.

luckyeod28

Something is up with either your tuner, dyno guy or car. I've got the same set up and I notice a difference.

Stoenr

Just when I think I got it figured out which one I want to go with.................. Uggghhhhh, back to the drawing board

Patience

i did a JLT II w/ XCAL (not XCAL2)---hit 281 HP tp the wheels from about 5-6500 RPMs and torque maxed slightly over 300---i was hoping for 285+ and was wondering if i may get the with an XCal 2---my baseline was about 263HP and 283 Torque---

tom281

Now that's what I want......to hit around 280 peak but over a much broader range like you're doing, say 5K to 6.5K. My tuner is supposedly working to open his own dyno, so when he does maybe I'll get a discount on additional dyno time and we can find out why the car isn't responding better.

xetrov

This does not make me feel good....anyone know if Brenspeed would take these parts back and switch me out for a C&L? I was going to get it until the last second....so wish I had.

05-1947

I don't think that you need to switch the intake. I have the jltII/xcal2 combo with the brenspeed tunes and went from 98mph to 102mph in the 1/4 and the old buttometer can tell a huge difference. BTW, the two different runs were almost equal air temp/quality.

xetrov

That's what i'm saying...my buttometer doesn't register any real change...i'll see if I can get it up on the dyno at the tech college my cousin goes to.

nicksolheim

I wouldn't make any changes based on one man's expeirience. And the JLT pipe is not the problem. There are lots of people on this site that run the JLT pipe and have great gains cause of it, wether they are using the Predator or SCT Xcal.

Like some else said there's most likely a problem with his tuner/tune or dyno guy, heck maybe he got a lemon from the factory who knows?

Chances are, you'll be completly fine.

BTW in no way am I saying the JLT is better than the C&L or vice versa, but I am saying the intake is not the cause for the low #'s.


Tom281................. sorry to hear about your situation, hope you get everything straightened out.

Mongoose

I have the JLT and AA SCTX-2 tune and it kicks butt. Dyno numbers really do not mean as much as how fast you can do the quarter mile. The only numbers that interest me are the fuel/air numbers. If the car is bogging off the line then you need to launch at a higher rpm. I am still learning to drive mine consistently. These motors need RPM to make power. Ask some of these manual guys what rpm they launch.

tom281

Even after my experience, I wouldn't tell you to not buy these parts. Every car is different......alot of people have gotten great response from this combo.

The fact that my car stock dynoed as high as it did kinda points out that it runs good stock. My tuner is very well known on this site. I just didn't benefit much from adding the combo.

To xetrov, don't be afraid to try a different tune from a different company. You will need to download the software from sctflash.com, have the tune emailed to you as an .xtr file, then install it into your X2.

Trampus

I see what you're saying now. I re-read your original post and I see that your complaint is that it's only making the max power in a very narrow RPM range. I'll have to look at my dyno sheet and see but I'm pretty sure that mine isn't that bad.

For the OP, please don't let one persons bad experience sour you from this setup. If you read a C&L thread you are also going to find at least one person who isn't satisfied with the results.

Tucker

Tom 281, did you ever do a base line? Not put back to stock and run it, but a base line then swap parts?
Sounds odd, but there is a difference. If you drove around stock and then dynoed your base line would be lower.

Without having a starting point in the stock set up it's very hard to say " I only gained X'

As others have said, it's odd your particular car didn't respond to this mod as others did, but without a base line it's hard to say it didn't. Sometimes the but-O-meter isn't as sensitive.

Some people feel 10 rwhp and some can't feel 25 rwhp.

I also would have to assume that if you were to swap parts and use the same tuner things wouldn't be a world apart. For some your car doesn't like the air or the tune, not sure which.

Resent 5.0 test they got 28 rwhp from the JLT and a quick tune. So you should feel that power. Air flow is air flow, no matter what car it's on.

I hope your not upset with JLT and I hope you get to the bottom of the low #'s.
Thanks for your support.

Jay

tom281

Jay,

Their was no true baseline taken; just the comparison of dynoing the car with the mods, then without. On the same dyno, just minutes apart from each other. I understand what you're saying about having the parts installed then removed and how it could possibly affect the dyno reading.

Anyway, my car would not respond to additional timing; there was no difference in power shown between a tune for 87 octane or for 93 octane, although the car had been running on 93 fuel for a couple of weeks. Maybe bad fuel, cam timing not up to spec, etc.??? But for whatever reason, we just didn't see the numbers where we expected them to be.

All this being said, like I stated previously I still wouldn't tell someone to not buy your kit or the X2 tuner, or the combination of both. Many people have experience good gains from this setup and are very happy with it; and we're not done playing with my car. I've tried a different tune from a different shop, and that seemed to help noticeably but I don't have dyno numbers to prove it yet. All in all, I am not disappointed with the quality of your kit, my tuner's knowledge, or any of the parts in general. I do not mean to degrade any person's parts or knowledge, I just want to be sure that my car is performing like it should be with these parts installed.

Thanks for your concern, once we get more dyno time I'll post back with the results.

tom281