My Blue Heaven

Well, I'm thinking my screwed up 4.10 (whirring, extreme moaning at 55-62mph)screwed up my dyno run last night. 4th gear overdrive off 65 mph, nail the throttle and as the rpm's sweep up, when it hits 5K there's a pause, maybe half a second, but you can see the tach just stop dead, then it moves on to the rev limiter. Makes the funkiest graph you've ever seen, which you won't see till I can scan it, which won't be for awhile. Did a couple of pulls in 3rd and it gave us the predictable torque/hp curve. As best we can figure we got 255rwhp. This was a stock motor, no HC trap and 91 Octane gas.

Hooked up the predator, flashed it for 91 octane "performance" tune, for lightly modded engines (what the predator said, have no idea what that might mean)changed gear to 4.09 (why no 4.10 I wonder, since I don't think a 4.09 is even offered for a ford 8.8, or am I missing something). Re dynoed. Surprise, surprise, I lost HP and torque, by the tune of 5 rwhp. As you can imagine I was jumping for joy. At this point we didn't think it was the rear end giving up the weird readings. That came many hours (yes hours) later after we'd explored all the wonders of the just off the shelf Predator which is so new and rushed to market that they didn't have a manual, just a sheet of paper telling you that since your so lucky to be one of the first to get the tuner you're blessed with being able to download it off their web site. (I had forgotten the joys of dial-up till last night) Of course the manual doesn't even begin to cover all the function it monitors and it seems most of the abbreviations were lost on my tech as he was seeing the new tuner for the first time too. It is a cool tool, and with training would be a powerful tool. In the hands of an idiot I think it could probably bring about the apocalypse, or at least seriously your pretty new mustang.

So, last night was a bust accept for my speedo is now corrected. My gracious tuner is going to work on a custom tune which he'll install next saturday AFTER I get my gears replaced hopefully correctly this time. Knowing NOTHING about rear ends (on cars) I can't begin to guess what might have been going on back there, I assume lots of friction and who knows what else adding MORE drivetrain loss of hp. Why the tune didn't work is anyones guess. We checked spark and fuel tables and they were adjusted, for whatever reason it just didn't translate. It DOES shift better now, goes a little higher up the revs rather than bang-bang-bang 1 2 3. With the 4.10s I can now not only light them up in first, but in second too ....from a dead stop

Did do some gas milage figures for whoever cares:
75 cruise = 19mpg
65 cruise = 21.5 mpg
55 cruise = 25 mpg

For those of you who've never dynoed, it was intimidating at first, I couldn't get over feeling scared to death to nail the throttle while the car is strapped down to the floor. I got over it pretty quick. Also, don't recommend you take it with snow tires on, that drum eats tires after a few hours

So, for all the "i got 20 rwhp with an out of the box tune" stories you've read, here's one that got -5 rwhp. Hopefully I'll see 10 when all is said and done and I'll be happy about it. Long range I think the tuner is a good idea, especially for tire and gear changes for the speedo, transmission shift issues, idle speed, etc, but if you think you're gonna get mind blowing hp increases out of it WITHOUT a custom(meaning dyno tune from an expert) setup I think you've bought into the marketing hype. Of course, that's coming from a guy still about last night.

That's it, more to come as it happens, gear change next week, the dyno #2. I'll see about posting the graphs so you can see wierdness in action.

Chris

ZRX4ME

some of these companies are rushing too fast to bring stuff to market just to make some $$$$$$$.I have a story to tell too(not computer related),but can't right now cause im trying to get them to take it back.Hopefully next week I can talk.

PACETTR

Good luck...

HOTLAP

Same here Chris - good luck and stay with it - you'll get it sorted out in the end. Worst thing is after all the anticipation about the mods and increased HP - then these results - can u say CRUSHED!! I would be.....speaking of which - I have the JLT/SCT, ud pullies, x-pipe all coming in for install....hope it goes well.

Hang in there B)

afcop13

I hope it works out for you and you get those numbers back into the + category, and higher than +10.

I've waited for mods simply for these reasons. I know that so many companies are jockeying to be first with stuff that I think by this fall I'll be able to save a few bucks and also see whose products are the best. I'm thinking that I'll probably drop 3-4k into it when I do jump, I'm just afraid to jump too early.

38special

My Blue Heaven

I thank you for the idea of downloading the manual. My C&L CAI and Diablosport Predator gets here Tuesday. I do not think that I will have any problems since my car is stock, except for the C&L CAI that has a custom tune for that mod on it.

I do not plan on changing gears or exhaust. Lee said that pullies will not effect the tune though, so I may put underdrive pullies on next.

wild stray

Chris;

Do I understand correctly that you had 4.10's installed and put the car on a dyno the same day?



Tks,

Paul

joeuser42

Interesting note from the Predator manual:

TUNE INFORMATION

DiabloSport Performance - For stock to mildly modified applications - NOT FOR USE WITH SMALLER UPPER AND/OR LARGER DIAMETER LOWER PULLEY APPLICATIONS

AFTERMARKET PARTS
Use of the DiabloSport Predator with aftermarket products is at the owners risk; some aftermarket products create rich or lean conditions based on design by the products manufacturer. It is impossible to test every possible product so please proceed with caution when using any product related to adding airflow like throttle bodies, filters and cold air intake kits or boost in the form of pulleys, or blower upgrades, changes in exhaust systems or exhaust components, even rear end gear changes (which make rate of acceleration changes can affect air fuel ratio). Customers with these modifications may need a custom tune from Diablosport one of its CMR dealers. DiabloSport recommends the use of a dyno and air fuel meter to monitor data when adding aftermarket products to make the proper tune changes with Predator.

I wonder if anyone else is having issues. I have 4.10s installed and am expecting my Predator on Tuesday.

My Blue Heaven

Paul, I had the 4.10's installed on Presidents day, and the dyno run was 3 days later.

Chris

My Blue Heaven

Jamie, I read that in the manual too and had to laugh. They are basically saying unless you have a bone stock GT the predator tunes that come with the unit are useless. Who's going to drop 400 on the tuner and NOT do other mods?

Also noticed that the shift pressure that's advertised isn't available yet, at least not that I can find. Also, the shift points are set by mph?? I don't know about you, but I have no idea where my mph is where I want to shift, but I dang sure know what rpm I'd like it to be.

wild stray

[/quote]

Paul, I had the 4.10's installed on Presidents day, and the dyno run was 3 days later.

Chris

In my experience, I would let the new gears seat in for a few hundred miles before I put the car on the dyno or run it at the track. Just from observing my car, I've noticed that every mod I've done seems to require the car to "get used to it"....I don't pretend to be able to explain it.
Also, in the past I have had the dyno people tell me that my readings might be a little lower with new gears because it "might" not put the same load (for info purposes) on the dyno. My current tuner said the same thing. If your tuner has experience, he should be able to easily make adjustments to timing & a/f to get you better numbers. As always.....IMO

Paul

38special

Lee can pipe in here himself, but I thought he said the C&L tune on the predator would not need to be changed with cat back exhaust or underdrive pullies.

My Blue Heaven

Dyno sheets are listed here http://forums.bradbarnett.net/index.php?showtopic=17163


At this point I'm not so concerned about the diablo not working. I'm going to email them and ask their advice about the tune and what might have gone wrong. Also my tuner is going to work on a custom tune for me that we'll hash out next weekend.

Chris

My Blue Heaven

Update on the Predator tuner. I emailed diablosport and they informed me that my unit was a pre-production beta unit. Funny, I don't recall requesting to be a beta tester.... They then informed me that they had new firmware revisions out. Tried to access them on their web page and was unsuccesful as the links were broken. Still waiting on the reply to those emails.

In the original reply to my email concerned about my HP loss, they said I was obviously doing something wrong as their product is great and couldn't cause a loss. BUT, if it really did cause a loss send it back since it must be defective as they have had nothing but glowing praise for their predator. I don't know if the praise has been for beta units or the actual production units.

As for the HP and TQ anomalies seems this is common on automatic cars as a few of you have pointed out. My dyno tuner says we'll be able to tune that out now that he has some more information on it.

When I asked in email about the HP spike on the dyno when they tested their automatic equipped GT, Diablosport didn't respond. 3 times.

It'll all work out in the end, just not as smooth as some of you have experienced.

Going in Wednesday for the 4.10 gear exchange and hope they get it right this time.

chris

169stang

I'm sure it'll all get worked out! I'm just glad I went with the SCT. I've already had 3 flashes with the different mods and it just keeps on getting better! If I was all about the Predator, I would have waited for the bugs to get worked out and avoided getting a "beta" model. Either they made you a guinea pig without your knowledge or calling it a beta unit is their method of saving face due to your issues.

joeuser42

Good one!

porsche

Predator tuner is great i must of got 30 rwh i hit 3 with the wheeels spinning.
try the new software.I have c@l intake bassani x pipie and tune and all i can say is wow ,wow,wow!!!!!!!!!1

My Blue Heaven

You musta got 30 hp huh? What did the dyno tell you?

38special

I just hooked up my C & L CAI today.

Car sounds a little different. It pulls better in 3rd and 4th gear. The motor sounds gggrrreeeeat at high rpms, but it did that before. I get to 80 or so almost instantly compared to before.

I'm still playing with the predator. Mine is the revised version. It comes with the new C&L tune as well as the Factory HP Tune, used for bone stock engines. I tooled around with that too, not shabby.

My Blue Heaven

My manual was inside a hidden fold in the box. Lift out the cardboard that holds the device in the box and you might find yours.

Black Magic

38 what is the revised part number. I get mine Wednesday. How do you change shift points? Is it really by mph? I thought you raise the rpm points. Going to be hard based on mph at WOT I would think. Thanks.