RKNMACH

A dyno tune is the best and that is my next step. A canned mail order tune will let you get started and is less expensive to update as you add mods. I would think the FRRP tune wil leave some room for improvement and if you get in bed with the dealer you will be able to expand the rules as you go along - they probably won't put you on the drums though. Also, if you go with the dealer you won't have any emissions problems.

Anonimac

Anyone aware of any posts (this forum or another) that compare the results of the FRPP CAI kit (with tune) vs. others? I'd love to know how the performance gains differ...

TillmanSpeed

Local Dyno tune over ANYONE's Mail Order tune.

Anonimac

I'm thinking that the full Steeda CAI kit with a tune will be the way i go. Thoughts? Recommended tuner? I kinda like the LiveWire one..anyone have experience with that one?

2K05GT

There was a shootout done by 5.0 Mustang Mag. last year
you should look it up, But most of your gains are from the tune, the FRPP setup uses a larger MAF 90mm but it still uses the stock intake tube that is a little restrictive, I think has shown gains of 18-20hp.

The K&N Air Charger is a No Tune Intake that says 15HP but I think most have seen more like 10hp.
I have gained 12HP with my 30.00 intake which required you to cut off the MAF of the stock intake lid and use a Spectra universal oil filter.

the C&L and JLT II have shown as much as 30hp with tune on a dyno. So FRPP's Tune is VERY conservative.

The best thing about using Mail order tunes is if you have an Automatic, all the tuners are tunning very aggressive shift points and pressures in them, where the Manuals are air/fuel/timing/rpm type stuff. Most local tuners are not good automatic tuners so for the most part us auto guys get better results from Mail order where the manual guys get better results from a local dyno tune.

2K05GT

I am going to call you someday an dyno tune my car, your only a few hours away, how are you with the Automatics?
I want a very aggressive Drag tune. Can you help? there are no good Automatic S197 tuners in my area

2K05GT

SCT XCal is the best, most tuners tune for it.

ChevyKiller

Alas this was true until now...

For s/c guys, ST Motosports has the kits from hell. Adam is offerring two stages in a few weeks and they kick **** no doubt about it.

I put the TB & intake on my car with no ther mods at all and not a single change to the tune and the car picked up 86 rwhp and 89 ftq. Better yet, it picked up 5 mph in the 1/8 mile and added 7 mph to my 1/4 trap. I went from a 10.90 ET to a 10.52 with just the intake & TB added. I was also able to keep power through 7K rpm with at 15 psi with no issues at all. He will soon have a KB and whipple kits out. The TB is a giant custom single blade monster that flows 1900 CFM!! Yet idles smooth as stock on the street...

Here is a quick dyno clip to see how the set-up looks on...

http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v6...T9Aug07005.flv

Here is a quick clip of what this can do with a daily driver...

http://videos.streetfire.net/video/c...880167acec.htm

ChevyKiller

I'm glad your an sct fanboy and all but I'd like to remind you that the first 3 S197's ever in the 9's was done on a predator. The current world record holder is tuned with predator. The 2nd and 3rd fastest street legal S197's in the country are tuned with predator.

The truth is one is not 'better' than the other and people should stop saying it they are.

It comes down to the TUNER using it and what software he has the most experience with and what company HE has the better relationship with.

Personally, I like Diablo the best. But does that mean dibalo is > than SCT - certainly not and vica versa.

don_w

Amen brotha... amen.

RKNMACH

Try Wheat at Springfield Motorsport. He's going to do my dyno tune - I have a 5 speed but I would still check with him about the automatic.

Anonimac

Seems like from what i've read that if you have a NA car and don't plan massive mods, aftermarket TBs are just not necessary, in fact, most lead to problems. Is that accurate?

This is very disappointing if it is true because companies like granatelli (side note: there doesn't seem to be a post of any kind about granatelli TBs in over 6 months) still market their TBs as not having any problems, offer significant performance gains ("Adds 11 peak HP & 22 mid-range HP (GT)"), but that just doesn't seem to be substantiated by actual customer experience! Can someone comment on THEIR experience with Granatelli TBs or point me to posts (on this forum or another) that are somewhat recent where people are telling their experience with Granatelli TBs? Actual dyno runs? I'd definitely be willing to buy any direct bolt on part that is relatively inexpensive and yields 11 HP but not at the expense of instability, error codes, pinging, rough idle, etc...

MSGTGT

Here's a post I made on a local Mustang forum a few months ago.

Subject: BBK 62mm Throttle Body
Application: 2005 - 2007 4.6L Mustang GT

I have to give the BBK 62mm Throttle Body a big thumbs down. I tried it first with a K & N CAI and again with the Paxton S/C. In both cases I had to remove it and reinstall the stock throttle body. The car would simply not idle correctly. It would lurch at low RPM's and run erratically. I just changed back to my stock throttle body and I’m back running smoothly again.

Don’t waste your time on this product.

2K05GT

Yes Accurate .....

YES, I had the Granatalli TB, It would Idle surge and it has stuck open on me once, I got several CEL with it, I returned it for repair and they sent it back with white grease in the gears, helped for a while then it would idle up and down 300 -400 rpm like a wave. When I let off the throttle, the car keeps going at the same rpm, then it would drop soon after.

My dyno showed 2-3 hp gains before tune and it leaned out the A/F and I had a K&N Aircharger. I had to pay for extra dyno time for the tuner to mess with it while tuning and only gained another 5 after the tune, THEY ARE NOT WORTH IT. I dumped it on EBAY for half what I paid. I just could not stand the problems I had with it.

Here is the Link to the Granatelli Challange done a while back and I think this buy gained 10 RWHP with a tune.
http://forums.bradbarnett.net/showth...tle+body+gains

Anonimac

Thank for those posts guys, i think it really clears it up for the throttle bodies. Isn't it disappointing though that they can still make those claims while the end user experience is so poor. I spoke to a BBK support technician who told me that most people who had poor experience with it weren't adjusting the voltage on the TB properly (or not at all). He said the new TBs are motor driven and that they need to be with 1.19-1.31 volts to work properly and that there was a little screw or something that would would tweak that in increments of .025 (i think). Sound familiar? Did you guys do that?

2K05GT

Yes I measured the Tip voltage and mine was right on. I thought maybe I had a bad one but as it turns out most people have had or will have problems with the aftermarket TB. One thing a friend did notice that when he got Charge motion delete plates the erratic response of the TB went away and he got more power from it.

this could be the case with the TB because the control valves are calibrated to a spesific airflow and they are tuned to control that flow. so you may need a set of CMDP from FRPP, but this would indeed create warrenty issues since the CMDP REQUIRE a tune and you are removing the stock control valves.

http://forums.bradbarnett.net/showth...tle+body+gains

http://forums.bradbarnett.net/showth...tle+body+gains

ChevyKiller

This is correct. The only TB that is worth a crap even for blown guys is the one I mentioned above from ST Motorsports and that is a complete 'system' with intake and all and not just a TB.

GRAYPNY

There are alot of performance mods that you can do you to your N/A car that don't include a TB;

1. Cold air kit with a tune (use this for a base and then get dyno'ed)
2. Under drive pulleys
3. Charge motion delete plates
4. One piece aluminum driveshaft
5. Electric water pump
6. Long tube headers
7. Gears

tom281

+1 to Rich's post......

grrman98

installed BBK throttle body with bbk CAI not sure of HP gain but it feels a lot better more repsonsive and sounds great