GhostTX

That brief letter just drips of some elitist, sheltered snob.

• Obviously favors imports.
• Totally ignorant of the impact on the market the Mustang has.
• Somehow thinks you have to have a college degree to "know" anything.

Tell him to get his happy butt out of there and let some of us college degreed folk that want to work there have his job.

obofglob

Must be why we love ours. Must also be why we don't hear any drone from the Borla Stingers, love the Hurst shifter and feel the ride with the frpp suspension is just fine. At least there are some good things about getting old!

ponyent

I agree with the original letter (sure I do).

It burns my butt that every time I drive past the local welfare office, there's nothing but Lincoln Navigators and Ford GT's in the parking lot.

It is obvious this guy knows much less than he thinks he knows. To demonstrate: he feels superior to people who didn't attend college. He obviuosly hasn't gotten too much in the way of real world experience.

The shame of it is he works for Ford. Hopefully that won't last long.

PaulF

Hey Charlie, where in Levittown are ya? I didn't know there was a TMS member so close to me....

Hollywood_North GT

Hollywood_North GT

OK, before everybody trips over themselves in anger, and falls into convulsions, and chokes on their own blue blood, I posted it because upon reading it I found it to be a curious post in and of itself - particularly if this guy really IS a Ford employee, which he may or may not be...and we'll never know, will we? Personally, I think his comments are ignorant either way, but ESPECIALLY if he's taken a job with a company whose products he apparently despises.

But whether it's this guy, or ten thousand others, it's a fact that Ford has a severe perception problem and needs to find a way to change it.

Hollywood_North GT

The FACTS are that Ford is sinking as a company, and instead of placing the blame where it squarely belongs: 25 years of substandard products, too many Ford loyalists would like to place the blame anywhere...everywhere else rather than own up to their responsibility for being more concerned with executive coffers than paying customers.

There's reason to believe that is now changing - slowly - but rather than rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic while it's sinking, maybe you should offer some constructive criticism of the company and some honest ideas about how they can improve their products. Because I'll tell ya straight up: all the marketing campaigns in the world aren't gonna change the public's perception. Only top-notch product across the lineup can do that.

And please, people, stop trying to pump up Ford by tearing down Toyota. In the eyes of public perception, we lost that debate a long time ago. Ford simply needs to concentrate on product - make the quality and feature content as good...and the styling better - and the public will begin to take notice.

05fordgt

Oh come on BC, 25 years of substandard products??? Thats taking it a little too far don't you think. I can believe some of the cars were downright bad, but with that logic, that would mean that everything that came out after 1981 was crap. I know that there was some bad vehicles within 25 years, but lets see, I'm going to name a few cars that did okay (at least in my eyes):

The Taurus. That was revoulutionary when it 1st arrived, and everyone loved it. That changed everything for the family car, when it came out, and people flocked to it.

The Focus. Now granted it had a TON of recalls when it 1st came out, but I just mean the car in general. The size of it, compared to the Escort it replaced, made all companies think that their small car was too small. Heck, Chevy had to totally rethink their Cavailer replacement, when the Focus 1st came out, because it wasn't a big enough improvement. Now, every car that competes with it, is larger than they used to be. The Focus started that trend.

The F150s seem to still seem to do very well. Everyone that has them love them (I know some owners have problems with theirs, but you can't please 100% of the buying public, it won't happen). But that truck still sells well (albeit when gas is reasonable), and has a HUGE loyal following.

The Mustang... This site alone is enough to rest my case on that one

The Explorer- I am just listing this as it started the whole SUV segment. It sold like cheap gas, when it 1st came out. Now that the segment has shifted, the car won't ever see the same numbers again, but there are a lot of people who still would buy one of these rather than a crossover.

SuperDuty pickups. The workhorse truck. Most configurations available, and a chassis that won't quit. When the new 6.4L Diesel comes out this winter, it will sell just like it did before. Plus the new truck is just better in everyway.

Five Hundred. Bland styling aside. You can't knock the car for being one of the safest cars available, and having Volvo AWD, and safety, it make the car rather nice. When the restyle comes out with the new 3.5L, it will help sales. In all, its a nice riding car.

Fusion. Even though its new, and their isn't a history with its reliability yet, it is selling rather well, and taking sales from import buyers. For the money (especialy with AWD) you really can't go wrong with one. Plus the styling is different, and that is a good thing.

Edge- A new vehicle that has drawn ALOT of interest, and getting good reviews from alot of anti-Ford publications and writers. This will make its targeted sales goal, I don't see a problem with that. Plus the styling, again, is something that is needed in this segment. Time will tell how this does, but so far the buzz is good.

These are a few cars that are doing good. Like I said, there were a lot of cars that didn't do to well (EXP, Capri, Blackwood, just to name a few). It won't suprise me if you list every single bad product Ford made, just to counter my post. Its cool if you want to, but when you come on here and say that the past 25 years, every product has been substandard, I just have to chime in and add my .02 cents.

TomServo92

I've worked quite hard to get where I'm at in my career and quite proud of it. Immature little taunts from you do nothing to diminish that pride.

Hollywood_North GT

Well then, I guess you deserve two sets of pom-poms.

Hollywood_North GT

Jesus, where to begin...

Well, first of all, some of the products you listed are old, and some are new. The latest ones are a big improvement, to be sure, though they don't yet go far enough. Also, I didn't say ALL their vehicles were substandard, I said that 25 years of building substandard vehicles (as the Japanese began the process of kicking our collective butts) is the problem. Sure, you can name a small handful of successful vehicles over that three decade period, but honestly, when I look at Ford vehicles from the mid-'70s to 2000 there's not a product I would have gone near, Taurus included, aside from the F-150.

Ford isn't losing money because people have a perception problem, Ford is losing money because they have had (and still have, to some extent) a product problem. Even the execs at Ford are owning up to this now. I think it's time the rest of us did, too.

Don't get me wrong, I'm rooting for them to pull it out. But anyone who has read my posts on this site - and I mean REALLY read them, not just picked out the stuff they DON'T like (<cough>Vermillion06) - knows that I believe in plain talk, not brand worship. Ford is one of the greatest American companies of the 20th century, which makes this kind of slide to the bottom unconscionable.

Too many people here keep arguing that adding refinement and improved quality to Ford vehicles would raise the price and kill sales. Well guess what? Other companies are doing it and they're gaining market share while Ford continues to lose it. Like Einstein said: "Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results."

05fordgt

I only wrote what I wrote BC because when you write "25 years of substandard products" that to me means all the cars from the past 25 years. Yeah the Taurus is old, but what I was referrencing to, is when it came out, it was revolutionary, and you can't deny that. I remember hearing the guys at Motor Trend when they named it Car of the Year, it was light years ahead of the cars from Chrysler and GM. At that time, the car was good. I know it got pushed back and Ford let that car slide, but like I said, the way you wrote your post, to me anyway, implyed that every car from the past 25 years was bad. No offense friend.

PaulF

I've got a 2003 Taurus and a 2000 Mustang and combined, they've been in the shop for a grand total of 1 problem...and that was recently with the Mustang....a simple sensor fix. My point here is to say that Ford has a quality perception problem, not a quality problem, at least in my eyes.

My parents were LOOOOONG time Buick customers. My Father drove a Buick up until a year or two ago, when he went to buy another Park Avenue and they told him that they wouldn't offer bucket seats anymore, that all of the extras that he wanted that normally came with the car, they were charging extra for. He turned around and bought an Avalon and loves it. I asked him why he didn't stay with a domestic and he said that he didn't think that the quality was there that the imports had.

So it's not just a Ford issue, it's the American auto industry in general. I think that the one thing that stands out on most of the cars is the cheap interiors, at least in my opinion. Personally, I think that US auto makers are doing a good job with the exteriors, if they could get the interior up to standard and keep the price reasonable, they could turn this thing around. But they are going to have to spend money on additional advertising to get the general public back into the show rooms to see it.

Vermillion06

Good God! Nobody here is denying that Ford is having problems! We know it! You've beat us over the head with it in almost every post you have made here! But you choose to constantly bring us doom and gloom every day, no matter how ridiculously unbeleivable it is, such as the unverifiable post from some other messageboard you started this entire thread about. How do we know this was a Ford employee? From his grammar and manner of writing he sounds like he's in junior high! We know the domestics have a perception problem! We're reminded of it everytime we mention what car we own in conversation and people say, "Eww, you bought a Ford?" with the same tone in their voice they would have if you had told them you picked your lunch out of the trash bin.
This doesn't sound like "constructive criticism"
Uhh, yeah, let's just ignore any successes Ford has had for the last two decades.
If you have such a poor opinion of Ford why do you hang around here? Does it make you feel all warm and fuzzy inside, telling us every day that you are sooo much wiser than us ignorant Ford loyalists? Or do you just enjoy moaning and complaining?
Great products can sink without the proper marketing. Example: Lincoln LS.

Trash talk from the media hurts as well. The Ford 500 is a good example. Its a quality sedan with conservative styling. It might not be flashy but it doesn't really have any offensive lines, unlike the Camry and Accord. When the press started calling it "bland", people's "word of mouth" started calling it "boring", which then became "ugly" and now it's being referred to as "hideous". I've heard people actually say "it looks pretty good; not as bad as I heard it was" when a 500 is pointed out to them in a parking lot after they've heard all the overblown criticism of the 500's styling.

So it's okay to criticize Ford, point out every single mistake,every single flaw in the company, and scrutinize and pick apart every one of their products and say they've made nothing but "substandard product" for 25 years?

Yet its NOT OKAY to point out anything wrong with Toyota? We're just supposed to ignore any bad news about Toyota or its products? Ignore their failures? I guess the increasing number of recalls on Toyotas lately just never happened? Why is it okay to do this for Toyota and not for Ford?
Meanwhile people like you continue to spread rumor and bad news about Ford no matter how unsubstantiated it is and continue to tell us all that is wrong with Ford and ignore anything that they do right. Way to be supportive!!!!

Here's a wacky idea: if you really want to help Ford, then vote with your wallet: buy one of their best products such as the Mustang, F150, Fusion, or 500. Then products that are good will have an increase in sales while products that aren't as good won't. That would help the company a lot more than moaning and complaining on a message board.

Zastava_101

Don't you people get tired ot this?

05fordgt

Tired of what Zoran, defending Ford, or countering BC's posts?

Zastava_101

Of what? Discussing same thing over and over and over ...

Evil_Capri

http://www.scothew.com/files/so_high.wav

Centurion96

I believe you are refering to the newer Feminine 150s. It doesn't take a crystal ball to see who their target buyer was. As you can see by my avatar I prefer the older 80-96 body style.

Can you say Mustang II

Missed again. First the whole SUV segment was not started by the Exploder, er Explorer. Prior to 1983 vehicles like the full size Bronco, Jeep Grand Wagoneer, Suburban, and Blazer were classified as "Utility Vehicles". Then in 1983 GM introduced the S-10 Blazer and the S-15 Jimmy. The following year Ford introduced the Bronco II and Jeep introduced the down sized Cherokee. All of these vehicles were also classified as utility vehicles but the mags like "FourWheeler" started describing them as sporty utility vehicles. It was when the non 4x4 crowd started buying them that Sport Utility Vehicle stuck as a moniker for these trucks. Unfortunately the SUV curse was also placed on the older utility vehicles as well. Finally we get to the Explorer, it was a replacement for the Bronco II which had many faults but it wasn't introduced until 1989. There is no way it could have started the SUV craze as it was 6 years late for the party.

We also didn't mention such gems as the Pinto, Fairmont, & Fiesta. Anything with a "II" after it was also a joke. Not all of Fords products were sub par, but when they tried to introduce a vehicle in catch up mode or when trying to compete with imports, then they were a day late and a dollar short.

I like Fords, I've had at least one Ford product parked in my driveway for over 30 years. On the same note I don't think there has been one Ford that I have owned that I did not curse out over some stupid design feature on that vehicle. Ford needs to stop playing catch up with the other manufacturers and lead for a change. They also need a governing body that is interested in the well being of the company and not how big a parachute they can vote themselves.

Back to the original subject, the attitude of the Ford employee refects the attitudes of a lot of post graduate degreed applicants I have interviewed over the last 15 or so years. They seem to come out with a chip on their shoulders that they know it all and that we owe them a job. I wish that the colleges would teach work ethic in their graduate programs. Before I get flamed by post grads, I went on to post graduate studies as well and I only said "a lot" which does not necessarily mean more than 50%.

Peace

BB

Semper Fi

05fordgt

OK Bob, I'm going to try to water this down so its quick. If you read my post, you would have seen that I said that Ford had its share of bad cars. I even listed some examples of them, with one being the EXP. Yeah the Pinto sucked, but the timeline is before the 25 years (albeit by 1 year). My argument was for cars from 1981 and ahead (as BC said 25 years). If your mentioning the "feminine" F150's, I am assuming you mean the 1997-2003 models. If you mean the 2004+ versions, I really don't see them as feminine at all. More squared off, and tough than the old ones.

If I messed up about the Explorer, forgive me. You can burn me at the stake later, lol. Back in 1981, I was in grade school. But the Explorer brought a whole new bunch of competitors to the market.

And lastly, about the Mustang II. Don't knock that car. Without that car, the Mustang most likely would have died a long, long time ago, and we wouldn't have the new style and this awesome website. I respect ALL Mustangs. They all helped the car get to where it is today.

And Zoran, don't blame me (or others who respond to BC's rants) about the whole "over and over again" with the topic. Tell BC to stop posting garbage that doesn't have any truth or facts to back up the post. He starts this stuff, and we are allowed to respond, last time I checked.