Cheese302

Ok,
so i was heading to a show with a group. Sitting at a light i had the clutch in and then the light turned green. i revved the motor to start going, but the car was in neutral. So i press the clutch back in and go to shift into first to roll out. But thanks to ford 's WONDERFUL throttle hang, the engine has gotten no where near back to idle yet. (probably 1200-1300 rpm) and as i hurridly shift into first the gear grinds. Usually no proble, but the grind seemed louder/ harsher than usual. so after this i am paranoid about hurting the trans. here is what i noticed.

1.when downshifting into first at a higher speed than i would normally shift into first the shifter seems to shake a little forward and back like possibly worn down teeth. but when at 10 mph or less even at 20 a couple times, the car seemed to go in fine.

2. when in fifth gear at low rpm (my car has 3.31's) the shifter seems to vibrate/rock back and forth a little, like its going with engine load. if the engine speed goes up it smooths up.

3. When in 3rd you can feel the shifter running through the teeth a little, kinda like if you have a shifter that doesnt have stops and golding it onthe forks, you can feel the teeth engaging.

they are the things i have noticed. the car goes in and out of gear fine, and doesnt make any major noise, but its on my mind. Probably just paranoid about having a new car, and these things might have been happening normally, but now i am noticing because of the grind...
any thoughts?

Tedz Pony

Well, for one thing, the owner's manual says to NEVER shift into first above 11 mph. Don't know if that plays in here, but you mention 20 mph, so it might.

NiteHawk422

Well if you have problems with your trans, it might have something to do with down shifting into first gear. That is always a no-no with the sync gears in a transmission. The slight vibration of the stick is normal under low rpm, it lets you know you are close to bogging the engine down. Save yourself some pain down the road and don't down shift into first, that will tear your gears up.

Cheese302

nah, i dont think so, when shifting into first, all i could hear was the synchronizer. the grind happened while stopped.

i dont usually downshift into first.

clintoris

I have the same issue... it seems sometimes it doesn't sync very well... I'll be at a light, have been at a stop for a while, and when I go to throw it in first, I'll grind. .... it's happened a couple of times, and it's not a little grind, where it feels like a couple of teeth rub a little... it's a full on grind heard be everyone in a 10 car radius. It has happened to me going into second a couple of times too... where normally it just drops in, but it seemed to hang a little... so I'm already on the way out with the clutch peddal and RRRRRRRR! there goes second! I have tried little things like moving my seat closer to make positively sure that the clutch is all the way disengaged/on the floor... but it still happens every once in a while. I haven't checked TSBs for any issues.

Cheese302

its the first time it has happened to me. i am just going to let it go. hopefully its a one time thing. but if the tranny starts making noise or anything... i'll take it in.

clintoris

yeah.. I'm kinda the same way... at this point, I can't completely rule out user error... as far as the missed shift incidents... but the grinding into first gear... I'm not going to make a mountain out of a mole hill.... yet. But, I'll screem loud as hell when I decide that it is in fact a problem. .... 'cause the squeeky wheel gets the oil... if you know what I mean.

Stoenr

Sure makes a cool winding down noise when you downshift into 1st and let that clutch out slow.
No I dont make a habbit of this either, but it still does it at 11mph.

theedge67

That winding down noise is your syncronizers saying "outch"

Cheese302

driving around yesterday, the car seemed fine. like i ws saying, i am letting it go, and if it starts making nise or whatever. time to go to the dealer. But if they wont cover it... 6 speed time

clintoris

You know, I had thought about a 6 speed too.. until I drove an '03 Cobra a few weeks ago. I had driven my ex-girlfriend's '02 Z28 with a T-56 in it, and really didn't like the skip shifting, and how the gates were hard to find, etc, but I had always heard that the Cobras had a better feel to their T-56. Well.. the only difference I noticed is that it didn't have the skip shift that GM uses in theirs. The owner had installed a B&M shifter on it and said it was way better than it used to be, but I'll tell ya... I thought it was craptastic. I couldn't find anything. I felt like a complete idiot trying to drive his car. I'm on my 3rd Mustang... and the T-5, the T-48, and the Tremec 3650 that we now have all shift very smoothly... but the T-56 is craptastic IMO. I guess I'd have to drive one that was built to see if I'd ever put one in my car... but for now, I'm plenty cool with the 3650..... just as a heads up... I would suggest driving a car w/ a 6 speed before you spend a ton of dough on it, and wind up not liking it.

Cheese302

thanks for the pointer. I will make sure to. but i really want to be able ot put gears in my car but still retain the nice overdirve i have now with the 3650 and the 3.31's. so i was thinking the t56 would be the way to go.

also i want to get rid of the dumb half mounted to the body half trans shifter. i want the shifter to be attached to the trans only. it just seems dumb to me. every other company that remote mounts the shifter (potiac gto/ bmw/ nissan) have the shifter mounted to the trans.

i will def. make sure to experience a car before dropping the dough. and besides i am only gooing to do it if i have a mojor issue with my current trans, which as it seems now, most likely wont be an issue

thanks for the comments guys. i started the thread mostly to get it off my chest, but the car seems fine.

Tony Alonso

People used to complain about how much noise, shifter movement, and effort they got when the shifter was direct mounted on the last Mustang. I believe that's why it was moved.

Tres Wright

It is highly unlikely you will ever do any damage to your tranny from grinding the gears. This is something that happens to everyone and the case-hardened gears are designed to take severe punishment for this reason. If you grind them every time you shift there might be a cumulative affect after months or years, but the accidental grinding every once in a while will cause no harm to the tranny.

Tedz Pony

Yeah, remember, they built these cars to be drivien by everyday people. They are not so sensitive that one or two mistakes are going to ruin the whole thing.

Imatk

Well I think your first indication that you may need to change the way you drive is what you wrote in your post:

"as i hurridly shift into first the gear grinds. Usually no proble, but the grind seemed louder/ harsher than usual."

This suggests you usually ("usual") grind the gears. If you are grinding the gears on a normal basis you need to either learn how to drive a manual car better or get an automatic.

Everyone misses a gear from time to time or makes a mistake, but if this is a normal thing then it's certainly bashing the hell out of your tranny.

With the issues you are having I would take it in to the dealer to be safe. Won't cost you anything as it's under warranty and its better than being stranded or worse your tranny going out on you when you pull out into traffic.

BTW don't tell the service manager that you do this often... they may try to say it's driver error.

Cheese302

no thats just a misread/mistypeing on me. I dont usually grind gears. what i meant was, the once in a while that i miss a gear, or dont have the car fully engaged in gear at a stop sign, there is a slight grind. That instance in the frist post is probably the third time i have ever ground a gear in this car. One other was going second to third, the second day i had the car. the third was this afternoon, i backed out of a parking space, the lever was only about half into first, and as i slowly let the clutch out, i saw the lever move, didnt even really hear a grind. The grind that i heard the first time, SEEMED a little louder than usual. I have seen no sign of an actual problem since. I was just trying to let off a little steam by placing the first post. and see if anyone had done the same thing, and see if they have had to have work done since. Looks to me from the responses given this is a one off thing, and most people havent had to have any work done to others, so i am kinda dismissing it. It took me a while to get used to driving the mustang daily due to having an MKIII VW prior to the mustang.


I learned how to drive stick in my driveway when i was ten, my first car at 17 was stick shift, and since i started driving my family has only owned one automatic car which is a '66 mustang, which is being converted to 5 speed. i know how to drive stick just fine. as for other problems, there havent been any i am convinced that the other "issues" i noticed are not issues at all, just normal functions of the trans/shifter in our cars that i started to "notice" because i was being paranoid, and never had to think of these certain things before grinding the gear. To the point that if i took my car to the dealer, they would drive it down the road, and hand it back to me talling me that there was nothing wrong. so why bother, i would prefer to be left on the side of the road, have it towed in and be garunteed that the work will be done, instead of just being told the car is fine, and then be stranded and make the trip twice. The trans is not making any extra noise, or feeling funny when going into gear, or anything of that form. So i think i am ok.

thanks for the input and suggestions, although seemingly a tad condecending, it's cool, and i have decided my course of action.

97svtgoin05gt

First, let me say that driving a stick is somewhat of an art and everyone has their ideas about what is right and what is wrong.

First, I often have this argument with my wife. I taught her to drive a stick and she has this habit of taking the car out of gear at a red light and then slammin the clutch on green and hammering the car into first gear. This sounds like what you did, and I was taught that you NEVER leave a manually transmissioned vehicle in neutral while on the road at any point. Simple reason for this is if you need to get out of the way quick or some other situation, exactly what you experienced here will prevent you from doing so. In addition, it take a few seconds for the clutch to slow down once you've depressed. The motion of depressing the clutch WHILE shifting into first gear can/will result in some grinding simply because the trans hasn't stopped rotating yet. The rule of thumb here to me is when sitting at a light, leave the car in first and keep your foot on the clutch. Be sure to keep it all the way in otherwise you'll wear life off the clutch.

Second, downshifting into first is an action that should be limited to VERY RARE occasions. If for some reason you are moving very slowly and suddenly need to take off like heck, do it but don't make a habit of this. That gear isn't syncro'ed like the others and won't put up with that for very long.

Third, the movement of the shifter is normal. The shifter is bolted directly to the transmission. Great care is taken in the design to prevent vibration and noise from getting into the car through the use of rubber gromets etc. but there will be some movement. It is normal.

Things to look for with a bad tranny:

1) Popping out of gear under decelleration
2) Consistant grinding when upshifting normally
3) Lots of "bearing noise" like whining or marbly sounds
4) Failure of the stick to remain in any of the gears under power or with release of power
5) Difficulty shifting between gears when warm

Any of these conditions usually means you've got issues. Grinding a gear once in a while will not/should not damage these transmissions. Repeated offenders will be awarded the worn syncro medallian which generally will cause the trans to start popping out of gear. If it happens once, it will start happening a lot more in a very short time.

Kinda sounds like I've had my fair share of these experiences don't ya think??

Imatk

Yeah sorry Joe, it just seemed from your post that you may not be operating the stick correctly... glad it it's working for you though.

steevr

So the recommendation is never to downshift back into first unless you're stopped? What about if you come up to a stopsign (rolling stop) or better yet, we have speedbumps in our work parking lot. I usually cruise the lot in second or third gear, but almost have to come to a stop for the speedbumps. I shift back into first gear as I'm rolling a couple of miles per hour. I could just dog it in second, but I thought that would be harder on the car.