Serious Reservations, doom for the 05?
8/1/04, 07:15 PM
#1
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I own form new a 94 GT, love it, and after 92k not a single problem...............unheard of with my Japanese and German/BMW 330 cars. Was dead set on getting an 05 GT, until I saw an unattractive scenario unfolding......................................
I saw the 05 concept at the 03 NY International Auto Show, loved in, the Ford delegates needed security for crowd control. Then came the real 'thing' at the same show this past April....................I was the ONLY one looking at it!!!!!! ala GTO public response!!!! Is is only me or is the production car a very dull representation of a 67 some almost 40 years later, diluted significantly from the gorgeous concept?? The ext design lacks inspiration or wow factor for a sports coupe, the interior rather nice, and all the cheap apointments to save a few bucks is very much in evidence ie fixed rear view mirrors, fixed radio antennae, the antiquated rear axle. lackluster/homely front and rear fascia, and more.............the ONLY really competive component is the 300 HP engine, but hardly makes 'a car' .
Importantly, the ONLY test drive by a non-Ford biased person was the one individual on this website that reported the ride/handling was greatly infrerior to the similarly road tested g35 coupe, Z car, GTO, and RX8. I'm suspicious to that in about 2 months the car will have arrived at dealers and not ONE road test by any of the car mags, which are nearlly ALWAYS complimentary to a new car during it's honeymoon, later comparisons gets truly objective. This witholding also makes me dubious of how 'great' this 05 will be. I am certain I'll get a passionate response to the contrary, but have seen this same scenario with marginal cars play out exactly the same visa vie the Thunderbird, soon to be cancelled because of uncompetitive features and performance.
Lastly, I not in the lesat bit impressed with the two pieces of almost insignificant news released by Tang and you guys in a recent interview.............thought he was revealing the Holly Grail to you..................he in particular and the car seems to be 'lacking', big time I fear.
I saw the 05 concept at the 03 NY International Auto Show, loved in, the Ford delegates needed security for crowd control. Then came the real 'thing' at the same show this past April....................I was the ONLY one looking at it!!!!!! ala GTO public response!!!! Is is only me or is the production car a very dull representation of a 67 some almost 40 years later, diluted significantly from the gorgeous concept?? The ext design lacks inspiration or wow factor for a sports coupe, the interior rather nice, and all the cheap apointments to save a few bucks is very much in evidence ie fixed rear view mirrors, fixed radio antennae, the antiquated rear axle. lackluster/homely front and rear fascia, and more.............the ONLY really competive component is the 300 HP engine, but hardly makes 'a car' .
Importantly, the ONLY test drive by a non-Ford biased person was the one individual on this website that reported the ride/handling was greatly infrerior to the similarly road tested g35 coupe, Z car, GTO, and RX8. I'm suspicious to that in about 2 months the car will have arrived at dealers and not ONE road test by any of the car mags, which are nearlly ALWAYS complimentary to a new car during it's honeymoon, later comparisons gets truly objective. This witholding also makes me dubious of how 'great' this 05 will be. I am certain I'll get a passionate response to the contrary, but have seen this same scenario with marginal cars play out exactly the same visa vie the Thunderbird, soon to be cancelled because of uncompetitive features and performance.
Lastly, I not in the lesat bit impressed with the two pieces of almost insignificant news released by Tang and you guys in a recent interview.............thought he was revealing the Holly Grail to you..................he in particular and the car seems to be 'lacking', big time I fear.
8/1/04, 07:24 PM
#2
If you have any doubts, just cool your jets and wait another month for when all the media drive reviews are released.
If you do a search you'll find that there has been a test drive review pubished here from a Charoltte newspaper writer. He was VERY postitive about the '05 Stang.
The '05 Stang will NOT be a 350Z, which is good, because if I wanted a 350Z I would go buy a Nissian 350Z and I would NOT buy a Ford clone of a 350Z. The 05 Stang will be a great car. No it won't be everyone's cup of tea. But for those who like 99 - 04 Mustangs and want a car with the same sort of attitude and feel, the 05 Stang will be a similar type car but it WILL be better in every imaginable way.
If you do a search you'll find that there has been a test drive review pubished here from a Charoltte newspaper writer. He was VERY postitive about the '05 Stang.
The '05 Stang will NOT be a 350Z, which is good, because if I wanted a 350Z I would go buy a Nissian 350Z and I would NOT buy a Ford clone of a 350Z. The 05 Stang will be a great car. No it won't be everyone's cup of tea. But for those who like 99 - 04 Mustangs and want a car with the same sort of attitude and feel, the 05 Stang will be a similar type car but it WILL be better in every imaginable way.
8/1/04, 07:25 PM
#3
Are you crazy? The 05 is gonna be spectacular! Oh man, one bad review! That guy was probly making it up! Oh man, people weren't crowded around it for ONE day! Oh man, I thought he was gonna give you all his knowledge of the 05, at least they got to talk him! If your not gonna give it chance, why are you criticizing it? Like me with mayonaise, never had it, won't touch the stuff! Its people with atittudes like yours who make others feel bad! Give it a chance!
8/1/04, 07:34 PM
#5
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Doesn't matter what other people think, if you like it, get it. If the public at large doesn't like it(i.e. doesn't buy it) than the car will become all that much more unique...
I personally love the car, and I believe its gonna be a smash hit when the general public actually sees this car on main street...
As for not hearing anything about it, what about Dodge and the Charger...the car is due to be released next year...and no solid clues about how it will look or any preliminary specs...at this point for the Stang, we had a 95% idea how it would look and basic specs. Not seeing Mag Articles ain't bad, Ford will try to time Mag releases with the release of the car...and besides, production cars won't be available for a month now...
I personally love the car, and I believe its gonna be a smash hit when the general public actually sees this car on main street...
As for not hearing anything about it, what about Dodge and the Charger...the car is due to be released next year...and no solid clues about how it will look or any preliminary specs...at this point for the Stang, we had a 95% idea how it would look and basic specs. Not seeing Mag Articles ain't bad, Ford will try to time Mag releases with the release of the car...and besides, production cars won't be available for a month now...
8/1/04, 07:38 PM
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Just in case you are actually serious, I'll give you something to chew on.
- The concept '05 was based on a totally different platform
- It would have cost many more thousands of dollars to produce
- The suspension is perfectly adequate for the car; the eventual IRS setup on the (at this point theoretical) Cobra will be mucho expensivo. Ford didn't want to price themselves out of their market
- The GT can be had fully loaded for probably 28k ... care to look up loaded stickers on the cars you compared to?
- Interior styling is HUGELY improved
- Exterior styling is a personal opinion thing. You might not like it, but tens of thousands do and many more will. 120,000 at least in the first model year, because I guarantee this car won't sit around on the lots.
Stang is alive and well. Now, I've been on the net a long time, I can smell a troll from a mile away
So this reply was really just because I haven't excersized my fingers enough today, they're feeling stiff so I wanted to type a bunch of crap that everyone already knows because it's readily available ON THIS WEBSITE just to feed your ego 
G'day!
- The concept '05 was based on a totally different platform
- It would have cost many more thousands of dollars to produce
- The suspension is perfectly adequate for the car; the eventual IRS setup on the (at this point theoretical) Cobra will be mucho expensivo. Ford didn't want to price themselves out of their market
- The GT can be had fully loaded for probably 28k ... care to look up loaded stickers on the cars you compared to?
- Interior styling is HUGELY improved
- Exterior styling is a personal opinion thing. You might not like it, but tens of thousands do and many more will. 120,000 at least in the first model year, because I guarantee this car won't sit around on the lots.
Stang is alive and well. Now, I've been on the net a long time, I can smell a troll from a mile away
So this reply was really just because I haven't excersized my fingers enough today, they're feeling stiff so I wanted to type a bunch of crap that everyone already knows because it's readily available ON THIS WEBSITE just to feed your ego G'day!
8/1/04, 07:40 PM
#8
Obviously, being such an '05 freak, I disagree with some things you said, but there is nothing wrong with different opinions.
I never got to see the concept car personally, but when I saw the production car was at the '04 NAIAS, there was a huge crowd around it, to the point where I could not get near it, moreso than any other display at the show, '05 Corvette included.
Like every car, to each his own, there will always be people in favour or not. Some people critisize the new Mustang for being too retro, not forward enough, or lacking ornamental scoops and wings. Most people I have talked to that are non "car people" love the car.
I was one of the two members that got the chance to sit down with Hau Thai Tang last week. He stressed two things about the car that are very key. To get the Mustang in the proper price range, you could either have 300Hp with VCT and 3 valves, or an IRS. I think he made the right choice. He also said that people should pass judgement on the car when they test drive it themselves. His background is in chassis and suspension, so I am sure he directed a competent design of the rear suspension. Obviously, he couldn't say things to us about the car that were confidential, not once did he stress the main reason for the IRS was for drag racing purposes, the reasons he gave us were stated in the interview and very logical.
I never got to see the concept car personally, but when I saw the production car was at the '04 NAIAS, there was a huge crowd around it, to the point where I could not get near it, moreso than any other display at the show, '05 Corvette included.
Like every car, to each his own, there will always be people in favour or not. Some people critisize the new Mustang for being too retro, not forward enough, or lacking ornamental scoops and wings. Most people I have talked to that are non "car people" love the car.
I was one of the two members that got the chance to sit down with Hau Thai Tang last week. He stressed two things about the car that are very key. To get the Mustang in the proper price range, you could either have 300Hp with VCT and 3 valves, or an IRS. I think he made the right choice. He also said that people should pass judgement on the car when they test drive it themselves. His background is in chassis and suspension, so I am sure he directed a competent design of the rear suspension. Obviously, he couldn't say things to us about the car that were confidential, not once did he stress the main reason for the IRS was for drag racing purposes, the reasons he gave us were stated in the interview and very logical.
c:
8/1/04, 08:29 PM
#12
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I was at the 2004 New York International Auto Show and could not get a decent picture of the 2005 production Mustang because there were too many people drooling over it. Half of the pictures that I took have peoples heads, hands, and butts in the frame. I went back to the car 3 times over five hours to get a better picture, but it was always packed around the car. Not everyone looking at it was a Mustang fan, judging from the conversations. However, everyone seemed to love the styling. I can vouch for the public response for the GTO. There were like 4-5 people at the GTO the few times that I walked by. It seemed people would look at it, shrug, and say it is ok. The ones who got inside it liked the interior, as many people do. But it was definitely not a magnet, unlike the mustang, at the car show.
Some people keep complaining about the production car not looking like the concept. Production cars rarely look identical to their concept version. The 2005 production Mustang embodies everything that was great about the concept, the classic fastback styling with the classic muscle car stance. I have a 1967 fastback mustang and the look of the production car is not a dull representation but more of a modern interpretation.
The mustang has the WOW factor in my opinion. If it does not have the WOW factor in someone elses opinion....do not buy it, do not look at it it, do not lurk around 2005 mustang forums to rip it. We will see how it will perform in good time. Ford has put so much work into the car that it is really improbable that it will not blow away the previous generation Mustang. But even if its performance stays on par with the current 'Stang, it still has the new styling that so many in this forum love. Mine is on order(Black Premium GT, IUP, manual, machined aluminum wheels, 1000 Shaker) and can not wait until it arrives.
Some people keep complaining about the production car not looking like the concept. Production cars rarely look identical to their concept version. The 2005 production Mustang embodies everything that was great about the concept, the classic fastback styling with the classic muscle car stance. I have a 1967 fastback mustang and the look of the production car is not a dull representation but more of a modern interpretation.
The mustang has the WOW factor in my opinion. If it does not have the WOW factor in someone elses opinion....do not buy it, do not look at it it, do not lurk around 2005 mustang forums to rip it. We will see how it will perform in good time. Ford has put so much work into the car that it is really improbable that it will not blow away the previous generation Mustang. But even if its performance stays on par with the current 'Stang, it still has the new styling that so many in this forum love. Mine is on order(Black Premium GT, IUP, manual, machined aluminum wheels, 1000 Shaker) and can not wait until it arrives.
8/1/04, 09:34 PM
#13
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Yeah, during the Chicago Auto Show at least 75 to 100 people were crowded around the 05 Mustang...at 10:05 in the morning on a Thursday...that's five minutes after the show opened, the reps weren't even ready yet!
I went again on Saturday and the crowds were huge...lots of people around the Mustang and the Corvette...about six people milling around the GTO...a lot more people were looking at the Pontiac roadster, maybe two dozen.
I went again on Saturday and the crowds were huge...lots of people around the Mustang and the Corvette...about six people milling around the GTO...a lot more people were looking at the Pontiac roadster, maybe two dozen.
8/1/04, 09:39 PM
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I test drove the GTO, My mustang had better get out of the blocks, better road handling. Sounded better too. The sales guys were looking at my car while I was on the drive.
I wanted to test drive the SSR, but the dealer only had two, and if you buy or get the paperwork completed to buy it then they would let you test drive it? What a roll out fot that one. Looks cool though.
Later at the Mazda dealer...
The RX8 had no low end torque either and sounded like a lawn mower.
Bang for your buck is what you get with Mustang.
I wanted to test drive the SSR, but the dealer only had two, and if you buy or get the paperwork completed to buy it then they would let you test drive it? What a roll out fot that one. Looks cool though.
Later at the Mazda dealer...
The RX8 had no low end torque either and sounded like a lawn mower.
Bang for your buck is what you get with Mustang.
8/1/04, 09:48 PM
#15
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oh geez, im surprised i havent seen a hater on here going you fanboys are all the same! BLAH BLAH BLAH. if you dont like the car then stay off the "MUSTANG SITE" and stop wasting our bandwidth! and time. if you want to talk about the 05 or something revelant to mustangs then welcome. and oh no it doesnt look like the concept boo hoo, im not going to get one. and if it looked like the concept, you would probably be like, it looks too much like the concept, they didnt change anything
8/1/04, 11:23 PM
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Tell me I'm wrong about the new Stang!!!
Very well. You are wrong. :notnice:
Clearly, the folks in this forum are not exactly a representative sample of the U.S. population. So let's take a look at some data.
--A google search of "2005 Ford Mustang" yields roughly 16,600 hits. Compare this to the respective counts for "2004 Pontiac GT0" (ho hum) and "2005 Chevrolet Corvette" (yum yum!) and you will find that these cross town halo cars have less hits COMBINED.
--A search restricted to images only finds just under 1000 05 Mustang pics (981) and barely 150 more for GTO and Corvette combined.
--Over the past ten years, this car has sold an average of 150 thousand units per annum, on a platform that dates back to the Carter Administration. That’s what I call a customer base.
Now, how bout a sampling of (p)reviews from reputable and not so reputable sources:
-Inside, the production model actually looks better than the show car. Motor Trend
-29 carats of painstakingly crafted Detroit nostalgia, a visual hit parade from the pony car’s greatest days. Car & Driver
-The next-generation 2005 Mustang was constantly surrounded by show goers who had nothing but good things to say about the new pony car. Road & Track
--When the all-new Mustang hits dealer showrooms this fall, there's likely to be another stampede of buyers. Gen 5 is shaping up to be the most exciting Mustang since the original of 40 years ago. Popular Mechanics
-All-new underpinnings, new engines and a sweet new shape make this one of the most anticipated Mustangs ever. Edmunds.com
-You may want to check into the ICU ward and strap on the EKG whilst reading about the new 2005 Ford Mustang, the first ground-up renovation of the classic pony car since 1979 and easily one of the best-looking efforts to emerge from J Mays' halls of car couture. The Car Connection
-A sensational blend of old and new, classic design and modern technology, power and refined style, the 2005 Mustang will be sure to take previous Mustang owners back to the hay days of their first pony. Canadian Driver
-Flat out, this car is going to be a smash hit. Autosite.com
Can you say CONCENSUS. This car has yet to hit the streets, and is generating more positive buzz, more critical praise, and more auto enthusiasm that any other car launched in the last quarter century. So the long and short of it….while I respect your opinion and all, I cannot help but wonder if you suffered a brain lobotomy before sharing it :scratch:
Very well. You are wrong. :notnice:
Clearly, the folks in this forum are not exactly a representative sample of the U.S. population. So let's take a look at some data.
--A google search of "2005 Ford Mustang" yields roughly 16,600 hits. Compare this to the respective counts for "2004 Pontiac GT0" (ho hum) and "2005 Chevrolet Corvette" (yum yum!) and you will find that these cross town halo cars have less hits COMBINED.
--A search restricted to images only finds just under 1000 05 Mustang pics (981) and barely 150 more for GTO and Corvette combined.
--Over the past ten years, this car has sold an average of 150 thousand units per annum, on a platform that dates back to the Carter Administration. That’s what I call a customer base.
Now, how bout a sampling of (p)reviews from reputable and not so reputable sources:
-Inside, the production model actually looks better than the show car. Motor Trend
-29 carats of painstakingly crafted Detroit nostalgia, a visual hit parade from the pony car’s greatest days. Car & Driver
-The next-generation 2005 Mustang was constantly surrounded by show goers who had nothing but good things to say about the new pony car. Road & Track
--When the all-new Mustang hits dealer showrooms this fall, there's likely to be another stampede of buyers. Gen 5 is shaping up to be the most exciting Mustang since the original of 40 years ago. Popular Mechanics
-All-new underpinnings, new engines and a sweet new shape make this one of the most anticipated Mustangs ever. Edmunds.com
-You may want to check into the ICU ward and strap on the EKG whilst reading about the new 2005 Ford Mustang, the first ground-up renovation of the classic pony car since 1979 and easily one of the best-looking efforts to emerge from J Mays' halls of car couture. The Car Connection
-A sensational blend of old and new, classic design and modern technology, power and refined style, the 2005 Mustang will be sure to take previous Mustang owners back to the hay days of their first pony. Canadian Driver
-Flat out, this car is going to be a smash hit. Autosite.com
Can you say CONCENSUS. This car has yet to hit the streets, and is generating more positive buzz, more critical praise, and more auto enthusiasm that any other car launched in the last quarter century. So the long and short of it….while I respect your opinion and all, I cannot help but wonder if you suffered a brain lobotomy before sharing it :scratch:
8/2/04, 12:07 AM
#18
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Originally posted by Rakshas@August 1, 2004, 11:55 PM
the 2004 gto returns 406,000 its, 3 times the stangs 168,800
the 2004 gto returns 406,000 its, 3 times the stangs 168,800
Perhaps the quotes in my post were somehow unclear to you. Go back to google, and put in "2004 Pontiac GTO" IN QUOTES. Then do the same for 2005 Ford Mustang, 2005 Chevrolet Corvette etc. etc.
The whole purpose of the exercise was to compare the web coverage of the two cars by using a common metric. The use of quotes allows us to standardize the entry. Get it?
Otherwise we get into a cute little pissing contest when I enter 2005 Ford Mustang and then someone else enters 2005 Mustang, or I enter Pontiac GTO and you enter just GTO etc. etc. etc. Any more nits to pick?
8/2/04, 12:11 AM
#19
I spent about three hours at the Phili show looking over the Ford / GM / Dodge displays trying to decide what I should buy as my next car. Here is what I noticed.
1. One or two people would walk up to the GTO display plaque to see what it was. The car was hardly noticable.
2. The SRT Viper had periods where ten people were looking at it for a few seconds and then no one would even go up to it for five minutes or so.
3. The SSR and Chevy SS concept got lots of attention! Half of that is because they were letting people sit in the SSR and get a picture taken.
4. They had 2 C5s set up next to the orange C6. The C5s got a lot more attention than the C6. Why? Because they were letting people sit in the C5s! The people mainly looking at the C6 were older men who I talked to and they are considering buying it.
5. Ford's display had a yellow 04 GT vert set up next to the 05 Redfire GT with the Ford GT spinning around on a platform right behind it. If that wasn't enough they had the Ford robot sitting in the middle of it all. The 04 vert was getting almost as much attention as the 05 but thats only because they were letting people sit in it.
What I noticed at the show is that a lot of people don't spend time looking at cars they can't afford unless they got to sit in them. Sort of like a once in a lifetime chance I guess. Need proof? Look no further than the Porsche display. They had about 10 or so cars including a few 911s and every door seemed to be locked. People would walk up, try to get in and leave when they saw it was locked.
The 05 Mustang is the only, repeat only, car that was at the show, including the Enzo Ferrari, that had people standing around it to the point where I couldn't get within 15 feet of it. Cars like the C6, Viper, Enzo, Ford GT, and Lambo's are incredible but in the end people spent more time looking at the "attainable" dream. I expect to see Ford churning them out by the thousands.
1. One or two people would walk up to the GTO display plaque to see what it was. The car was hardly noticable.
2. The SRT Viper had periods where ten people were looking at it for a few seconds and then no one would even go up to it for five minutes or so.
3. The SSR and Chevy SS concept got lots of attention! Half of that is because they were letting people sit in the SSR and get a picture taken.
4. They had 2 C5s set up next to the orange C6. The C5s got a lot more attention than the C6. Why? Because they were letting people sit in the C5s! The people mainly looking at the C6 were older men who I talked to and they are considering buying it.
5. Ford's display had a yellow 04 GT vert set up next to the 05 Redfire GT with the Ford GT spinning around on a platform right behind it. If that wasn't enough they had the Ford robot sitting in the middle of it all. The 04 vert was getting almost as much attention as the 05 but thats only because they were letting people sit in it.
What I noticed at the show is that a lot of people don't spend time looking at cars they can't afford unless they got to sit in them. Sort of like a once in a lifetime chance I guess. Need proof? Look no further than the Porsche display. They had about 10 or so cars including a few 911s and every door seemed to be locked. People would walk up, try to get in and leave when they saw it was locked.
The 05 Mustang is the only, repeat only, car that was at the show, including the Enzo Ferrari, that had people standing around it to the point where I couldn't get within 15 feet of it. Cars like the C6, Viper, Enzo, Ford GT, and Lambo's are incredible but in the end people spent more time looking at the "attainable" dream. I expect to see Ford churning them out by the thousands.
8/2/04, 01:11 AM
#20
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all I have to say is everyone is entitled to their own option... but some people just want to stir up controversy... the car is great.... and what I think it lacks..... I will change, just as I have done for many years... and when I am finished It will look better than a c6 or z on the road... oh did I mention that it will also handle, sound, look and perform better then them all...
I've been doing this much like most of you for years and this new 05 will be no different...
Except I think we have a better platform to start with.
"Low and Wide that's and 05 Ride"
I've been doing this much like most of you for years and this new 05 will be no different...
Except I think we have a better platform to start with.
"Low and Wide that's and 05 Ride"