Well this is a new one for me. I was driving out of the parking garage, and I was driving up the street for about a mile and a half. I noticed a jerking feeling from the car that seemed like the gas was cut, but then came right back on. I thought, ok maybe just a hiccup. Mile or so later and it did it again. Now I am getting worried. Another mile or so, it happens again, but this time, the computer beeps, and the information center says Failsafe operation. Now the car feels as responsive, acceleration wise, as a golf cart. So I pull over and check out the owners manual. Appears there is a problem, possibly cooling, and the engine gets turned to half power. Cool feature, but I was a little ****ed, because this was an out of the blue thing. I called the dealer, and the guy said something is wrong, and that it needs to come in for computer code checking.

It's in the garage right now, so when I hear about it, I will post. I just thought to myself...
1. This is strange since it was driving fine this morning
2. Cool feature to protect the engine and other components.

 

You better re-install your factory airbox and put whatever else (associated with the engine) back to stock. Or else you Dealer may not warranty it.

 

if you have a handheld tuner, plug it in and read the DTC error codes.

check your CAI, and whether the elbow is fit properly around the inlet of the throttle body.. any leak would cause you to run lean, misfire and knock!

good luck!

 

+1. Look at this first. In fact, look over the whole CAI install for any problems.

 

I've not added any engine mods, besides the CAI. It didn't require a tune or anything. It's all been stock except the replacement of that air intake kit.

 

I concour one time i had the pipe come lose from my CAI on my 99 and it did somthing like that. could barely keep it running since my whole thing feel off.

 

that's exactly the reason why i suggest you check it
if this was a JLT you won't have as much of an impact if it comes loose, as your ECU is tuned to deal with high flow of air.
while an untuned ECU with a K&N will not know how to deal with the additional surge of air should the K&N come off or leak in more air than it should.

 

****, Ok so I got a call back from him. He said what happened was that there was a leak in the seal to the throttle body. They needed to replace the throttle body. He was going to cover that under warranty. Also, he said there was carbon build up, and that a carbon service should be done soon. He said that would be around 200 bucks. Is that the price of a new throttle body?? Since it was there around 30K I said just go ahead and get that service done as well.

 

sorry dude but I think you just got hosed....

big time

the TB has a gasket that you can replace, this gasket is after the sensors inside the TB itself, so even in the reallllly odd chance that you had a tiny leak in this gasket it would not throw code, nor require a new throttle body.

And carbon build up ??? Jezzz, just remove the intake from the throttle body mouth, disconnect the power, spray some penetration carb cleaner, soak a rag in said carb cleaner, wipe with rag till clean repeat till rag wipes clean.

$7.00 in materials max.

 

so basically i was kinda right..
i don't know wtf seal he's referring to.. you just have to tighten the clamp on the air intake elbow if that's whats leaking

as to whether the gasket BEHIND the TB is leaking, well that means the gasket alone needs to be replaced, and not the TB..

FWIW i think they're taking you for a ride.
unless they can justify the $200 USD, as parts should be covered by warranty, and labour is a 15 minutes job!

 

So basically, when chorpeac said it was in the garage, he meant the Dealer's GARAGE.

Because you got a bill, guess it wasn't covered under warranty. Dealer probably took one look at the CAI and said .

Too bad you didn't read my post #2 before you took it in.

 

I'll give you $100 for your old TB....If I were you I'd be sure to ask him for the old TB and see if indeed they can produce one....Wanna bet it's still on your car?....

I don't get the CAI without a tune thing?....How do you know the new setup is good to go unless you have it checked? And why buy the CAI w/o a tune?....is it just for looks?

I bet the carbon problem....if there is one actually.....is due to the fact you do indeed need a tune for that tuneless CAI....

The first thing I did with my car was take it to a tuner and have it checked out to see how it was running and at what A/F....Every performance change I've made is always checked out with a dyno run to verify everything is OK....I just don't trust anyone that says you can slap this or that part on and "best of all....no retune is required".....they're in the business to sell the stuff, not wory about each individual's car....that's you job..

hags1

 

Yeah, Garage meant Dealer Garage. Sorry if there was a confusion. It happened yesterday on the way home, and it was my first instinct...take it to them.

They are going to cover the throttle body replacement. He just said the 200 bucks would be for the carbon maintenance...but didnt force me to do it at the same time. If I knew I would hav such a quick response, I would have waited before I told him to go ahead and complete it.

 

Don't sweat it man, we all got hosed at one time or another.

 

Why would there be carbon buildup on a Throttle Body?? There is no combustion taking place in that area, just clean air flowing over it. Carbon builds up from combustion, but how did it get there??? Sounds fishy to me!!

 

This is the upgrade I added.
http://www.knfilters.com/search/prod...x?Prod=57-2565

It reads Fuel Injection Performance Kit, so maybe it is not the same as a Cold Air Induction? I thought I saw it referred to that in places. It said in the packaging that it did not require a tune. I bought it for function. I have put K&N filters in all my cars, and I figured, hey why not put the next step up in my Mustang instead of just the filter. Plus since it didn't require a tune, where others did, I wouldn't have to mess with that whole thing. Trust me, I don't go to shows to show off the car. I just drive it.

I've been to this dealer, and I have worked with the same guy since I bought the car. I don't feel he is pulling anything on me. However, I am not a mechanic, so I might have described something differently, and I might not have fully heard exactly what he was saying, since the horns were going off in the background in their garage...

 

If you have performed any mods on your vehicle and are having problems with the dealer and your warranty then you should check out this SEMA information. To be honest, even if you aren't having any problems, it's an interesting read. Make sure to read attachments A&B included in the page as links:

http://www.sema.org/main/semaorghome.aspx?ID=50096

Chris "Skeezix" Nielsen

 

let me guess you never turned a wrench on an engine.....

you never get 100% burn, when the butterfly (thats the little plate thats inside the TB the controls the airflow) is closed and the motor is running, such as coasting, at idle and on decel, you get some unburnt gases from the cylinders pushed out through the intake ports, this vapor likes to stick to metal surfaces. Remember the engine is still firing, gas is still being used the piston continue to cycle, just the amount of air volume entering into the throttle body is greatly reduced. As alternate intake ports open drawing air in others are closing and some cylinders are in between, thus a small localised vaccum near two cylinders will draw out some unburnt gases into the intake manifold, the heavier particles will float towards the earths natural gravity and lighter "cleaner" intake air will float over the top, some atomized moisture in the gases mixes with the carbon/other exhaust gas particles and makes a sticky goo like film.

Over time 40,000 miles or more it "may" build up enough to alter "tip in" via MAP and TPI (TPS) sensors. Get enough crude and you can run into fail safe because of low MAP signals.

The use of an open element CAI increase the build up of minute dust/dirt particles that typically would be burnt off at WOT, but long duration of idle engine speeds will add to the build up of "crude" being attracted to the excess exhaust gases trapped in the intake system.

 

I'm a S197 newbie and I've only had mine for 2 months and have less than 1000 miles on it. I open the hood weekly to check fluid levels but haven't paid too much attention to the intake system on my steed.

I am however very familiar with the mass flow EFI "OBD II" 351 in my 96 Centurion Bronco (owned 8 years and counting) and the speed density EFI "OBD I" 302 in my former 88 EB Bronco (owned 12 years). You wouldn't believe the fun one has removing the little torx bolt located on the passenger side of the upper intake plenum. Tons of carbon and unburned fuel are dumped into the upper intake plenum on these engines thanks to the EGR system. It doesn't take long to coat the inner surfaces of the plenum. Add to that a silly little tube that Ford runs from the drivers side valve cover over to the air intake tube upstream of your throttle body and you get all the fine clean air inside your engine coating your throttle body.

So when you raise your foot off the gas pedal, all that crud that just came through the EGR valve will look for a place to rest. This will include the back side of the throttle body butterfly, the pivot points and the back half of the throttle body chamber. If you clean your throttle body remember to get and use throttle body safe cleaners ONLY. The throttle body has a special coating on it and should you use something like carb cleaner on it you will remove that coating and you'll be in the market for a new throttle body in the immediate future.

From the rocket ranch

BB

Semper Fi

 

oh yeah duh, I total forgot to mention the EGR, "hot ash" dump right into the intake tube.

I am a Honda guy at heart and we usually put a free breather on the EGR line.