Wombert

ah... I see... sorry

Tony Alonso

Robert and Kevin,

Thanks for the discussion. It's all about where you spend your money and create PERCEPTION. While I might not rate the current Mustang interior as one of the worst (ever seen a Yugo from a long time ago), it certainly would not strike you on first glance as beautiful because of the look of the plastic. I like the design but gaps and misalignments cause one to say "cheapo". Fortunately, the performance attributes create the aura for me of "awesome". The emotional connection is what sells a vehicle. The Japanese and European manufacturers have impressed enough people over the last 20 years to build a strong emotional connection because of things like interior appearance and assembly fit and finish.

Some people like features, some solidity, some styling, some fuel economy, etc. It's quite a balance to actually manufacture an automobile these days with all the PERCEPTIONS that must be formed to sell the car. What Kevin presented shows where the money was spent on the new F-150. It bodes well for the vehicle's future.

The chief engineer for the Mustang is a chassis guy. As he told us on the tour, if the foundation is good, everything falls together well. When I looked at the body-in-white display of the new Mustang in Nashville and at AAI, I saw precision. When you open and close the door on the new Mustang, you sense that with the sound you hear. When you look at the chrome and aluminum accents, you see better alignment. It is the beginnings of "nice interior".

So, at the expense of "analysis paralysis", I can't wait until I purchase the new car and enjoy the great looking interior! The aftermarket will provide even more options to customize from a great base.

Again, thanks for the discussion and information.

friedmaster

ford is also taking a stab at the japanesse makers with the my color thing.

kevinb120

Just from what I've seen(i spend more time looking at the pics of the motor bay, underside, and tech layouts of the drivetrain then the fenders and headlights), this car is going to rock. I think it will be one of the most signifigant US automotive products in 40 years. Of course its not as hi-tech as a GT(40) or E55, but for its asking price, its a LOT of car. Its beauty is in its simplicity and purpose of every single piece. Look at the suspension layouts and its robust built, even trick pieces like the aluminum tranny mount and the multi-thickness stampings. Nothing looks "forced" to fit. Like the F-series, its as clean-slate as you can possibly get, and without a signifigant retail price increase, pretty darn amazing. Not even mentioning its potential, this chassis is built to handle 3 times the gt's power. If you ever have the opportunity, get under a new F-series on a lift sometime and look in every single corner and component joint.

If Ford stays this course for the next few platforms, its gonna be a great time to buy American again. I cant wait to see long-term asessments of quality in the next couple years from 'consumer' mags on the F. Although I already see them making excuses to keep recomending the Titan, so there may never be hope for US products in that regard. :scratch: "although the Titan has a host of quality control and fit and finish issues, we still recommend it" They still hold the Freestar accountable for bad head gaskets on some 94 windstars :bang: Ford is finally making money again, and spending it.

kevinb120

I think the car has more gizmos and nice hidden touches then people are giving it credit for. I've seen imports with Nav units that the window buttons on the door dont illuminate A lot of them are count the gizmos, then put it on a lift and find out where you PAID for them. There are a lot of nice touches in this car. Wait untill the aftermarket gets hold of it, you better believe my switchgear and e-brake handle will be billet aluminum There is some purpose to keeping the shapes simple, you should see what all the painted 'aluminum' and multitextured gimicks on some cars looks like after 30k miles of rings and sweaty fingers have their time to work on them. All the flat surfaces and clear separation of parts leaves lots of nice places to slip in aftermarket touches like carbon fiber and aluminum.

You will forget ALL about message centers and nav units when you slip the clutch and lay down two stripes with AUTHORITY-no heavy effort to do it, and no feelings of flex, squat, or strain doing it. It will be rock-solid and easilly outpower its tires grip on demand. No feelings of launching a turbo-import of twisting motors and trannies, high rpm 'thunk' launches, having to shift and feather at the EXACT place in the 'powerband', bogging, or subframe quivers that will take its toll over the years on Sti's and Si's and Evo's. This thing will be right-now-press-gas-go-fast. Looking at the tech layout views, it will feel more like a full cage car, where nothing moves but the tires when you hit the loud pedal, but still not beat you up at the same time. Ingenous little things like the reverse L lower arms that allow a hard bushing at the front for the flex point for the knuckle and a soft one at the chassis point will quickly show why bmw has had so much success with the same idea.

legendlimetime

Kevin I love your description! Just reading that post makes me want that car even more. 3 months plus or minus a little is waaaayyyy too long to wait.

kevinb120

heh, next time some weenie with an RSX puts you to sleep with power-to-weight ratios and gas mileage BS, show them the part in the trilogy video where the stang breaks off and lays down perfect 90' twin stripes uphill in 2nd gear and keeps accelerating. Im also 100% for the live axle, not to bring that up again, but i've had the best both ways. I cant wait to see what 9lbs of boost, a reflash, aluminum flywheel and 3.90 Strange's do for it

kevinb120

oh, and I hope Ford patented the idea of 'my-color' hard-core-iron-clad for the Mustang.

38special

I was trying to be a little tongue in cheek. But what I said about Ford employees was true when I was there. If a Ford exec can't see the writing on the wall, when his employees are driving Japanese cars then they deserved the situation that resulted. As for preserving their jobs in a tight market, you would think that they would buy a Ford, and the employees who lost their jobs may regret their choice of buying a Honda.

I buy Fords to support America. I drove a Ford truck before I bought a Mustang. I bought a Mustang because of the improvements in the car after 1995.

You can find quality if you look for it in an American car, even in the 80's and 90's.

As for over priced autos: Some people will buy something because it cost more and then becomes a status thing. Value for the dollar is another thing, That is why I own a Mustang. B)

USA-Adam

If anybody doesn't like the plastic quality, this isn't the car for you. That's all I have to say. IMO the interior is 1000x better than the current car, but again, if you're buying the car for the interior and it doesn't measure up, go buy a Lexus - you're looking at the wrong car and segment.

justgreat

well, i'm glad kevin said it and i didn't: the mustang will totally eclipse any new car intorduction in the last 40 years. any of the old timers will remember what it was like when the original came out and that's what we're in store for. it's good to hear that the money was spent on the engineering side first...the other "stuff" will follow, in time. jackg 90seville 94k

os121

Kevin, as in most of your posts, you provide incredible insight into what makes a vehicle worth looking into and purchasing. In this particular post you provide a level of perception that is so keen and focused, and in my opinion .. right on. And to think that this is just another post that you wrote for all of us Mustang junkies who can't stop coming to this site for our daily fix. I'm sure that I'm not the only one who would drink the cool-aid if you were offering it (wish there was a kool-aid icon). Man.. you ever consider writing for a newspaper or magazine in your spare time ? Your posts are that good. Thanks for giving us so much to think about. I share in your enthusiasm that the new stable of quality-cars will mark a major turning point for Ford.

kevinb120

Kevin, as in most of your posts, you provide incredible insight into what makes a vehicle worth looking into and purchasing. In this particular post you provide a level of perception that is so keen and focused, and in my opinion .. right on. And to think that this is just another post that you wrote for all of us Mustang junkies who can't stop coming to this site for our daily fix. I'm sure that I'm not the only one who would drink the cool-aid if you were offering it (wish there was a kool-aid icon). Man.. you ever consider writing for a newspaper or magazine in your spare time ? Your posts are that good. Thanks for giving us so much to think about. I share in your enthusiasm that the new stable of quality-cars will mark a major turning point for Ford. [/b][/quote]
Thanks man

I would need to run the spell-check more often though

I am more objective to other cars then I act though. I love selling Ford product, but I also know what I'm selling against as well. There are cars, import or otherwise that I would not knock, I just hate blind generalities for so many cars. I do tend to give cars a fair shake, for instance, we got an 03 altima in today on trade, I WILL go out and drive it around the block tonite.

I also do not lie to myself about our products either. I know all the weak spots in the curernt car, and can appreciate what Team Mustang did what they did with the Mach with what they had to work with. I never left my Mustangs stock for a reason, nor do I line up next to a Z06 at a light with any false hope. I can be humble enough to know what I am driving.

TampaBear67

I read it in the Ford Press Kit.

Quote:

<span style='color:#FF0000'> More Standard Equipment than Ever
Mustang has always stood for value. The 2005 Ford Mustang has a standard feature list that makes its low purchase price an even better value.
Highlights include:
Standard power windows on all models with driver and passenger one-touch up (a new feature for 2005) and down
Standard "global open and close" windows – holding down on the unlock button lowers all windows while turning and holding the key in the lock raises them
Standard power exterior mirrors on all models
Standard power locking system with remote keyless entry, panic alarm and a key fob trunk release
Standard auto locking on automatic-equipped models
Standard heated rear window on all models
Standard interval wipers on all models
Standard fog lamps on GT
Standard speed control

It's little things like this that Ford has added to this class of car that are going to be taken for granted but really show what lengths Ford went to with this car.

As for being able to operate some of these functions by remote, I'm not sure about that, I guess we'll just have to wait and see.</span>

Greywolf

Kevin I wish my salesman was as knowledgeable as you. Oh well guess I have to buy from whomever I can find.

kevinb120

Here ya go, a genuine Kevin car review:



Actually its a 2002 3.5 SE. Good car to bring up for plastics quality :shock: Interior is somewhat stylish, untill you touch anything, and as you look around carefully it looses its luster in about 5 minutes. Has the standard neeto-torpedo black gauges that light up when you start, but terrible harsh orange illumination when they do. Numeration is as lame as the Xterras(may be same gauge set). Awful raised seams on the instrument cluster face, door armrest snap-on "pads", under the center console-armrest and steering column. Probably THE cheapest plastic ive ever seen on a nissan. I was able to pull the door inserts, armrests, cluster face and the steering column pieces, and outter vents OFF with no trouble at all. Hard seams on every vent blade, and part edge, seat bracket plastics are awful(if you push hard with a finger or two, you begin to see the white "stretch-marks" of plastic. Fabrics feel almost dry-rot harsh and thin, can feel the seat framework through the cushioning. Accidentally pulled headrest cover off of bottom clip.

Annoying wind noise anything over 30 mph, I checked the power windows to make sure everything is closed 3 times on instinct. Tire howl at 60mph. Stereo is decent-average, but isnt every stereo these days? Have no idea why the word Bose is on it(but then again Bose NEVER impressed me) By no stretch a match for a true premium stereo, such as BMW's 3 series harmon kardon systems. Silly radio shape makes aftermarket impossible(ala taurus). Gimmick raising center armrest feels incredibly light and you can actually twist the entire center console by flexing it back and forth, I heard a small crack and stopped doing it Obviously the radio controls(which are unituitive), power seatback, and a few other gimmicks are paid for by not spending money on the interior materials. Overall assembly quality is decent, but materials use is marginal(not a whole lot there-everything is thin.)-deja vu! Turn singnal/lights and wiper stalks are not mounted in ideal positions and even those feel cheap. Feels like I could toolessly take apart the entire interior. Ergos are nothing to rave about, feels very sit-on-the-floor like an 80's Japaneese sedan. You can rock the seat frame easilly.

Overall styling is pretty decent, better then average looking for Japaneese cars. Outside mirrors and grille can probably be pulled right off the car with hardly any effort. Metals are very thin, i pressed on the trunk lid next to the plate recess and it moved in over one inch. Most likely could dent the car without having to lean into it on almost any surface, was actually able to flex the metal AT the hip line(usually those edges provide strength to the cars body). Overall gaps are decent, except entire window frame area, and gaps at the a/b/and c pillars are sloppy. All door panels, fender, and other skins are paper thin and the car makes hollow BONKS on every sharp joint in the road. Can acutally flex window frame by hand with window down.

Has the 3.5 SE package and is definately fast in a straight line. Pedal modulation is poor, its on or off for brakes and gas. Had a lot of trouble not lighting up the tires in the rain at every intersection. The cars steering is very un-japanese, extremely numb and over boosted. Feels like there is a slop-spot at the top 1" either way, almost as if it had reciculating-ball steering. Follows grooves in the pavement and wanders. Torque steer uncomfortably pulls the wheel back straight with a lot of force everytime you touch the throttle, very annoying. Handles somewhat flat but has no feeling at all and screams FRONT WHEEL DRIVE. Does not feel balanced at all and front and rear suspensions do not rotate at the same rate. Begins its initial turn-in feeling like uncomfortably obvious oversteer will ensue, but then pushes quickly as soon as you begin to push it and UNDERSTEERS Go figure, Im not sure how they even got that to happen. Definately not a driver's car.

The Maxima is a very nice car, one of the closest to feeling like a German sedan, this one feels like its trying to be a Mitsubishi. The Nissan V6's are some of the best engines on the planet, but for some reason it sounds harsh in the Altima. I dont think any effort was made to dynamically tune the car to cancel out unwanted noise, It sounds almost identical to the 4.0 in a sport trac, and the shifts are harsh and jerk the wheel. Only redeeming quality is that it goes fast in a straight line, I was quite impressed with the power LEVEL, but its delivery is crude and torque steer is terrible. I know I said torque steer AGAIN, but thats all you think about when driving it. Very uncomplete package, and no match for the Mazda 6. I have always liked Maxima, and overall experience of the ones I have driven(last gen) I would give an 8 overall for the money-styling aside. The new one i have no experience with but the styling is a total turn off. This altima I would barely give a 4. Feels like a rush job. It may actually be outclassed by mid-size Korean sedans(on interior it definately is) its NO match for mid-equipped Accord or Mazda 6, two of the best low-mid 20k sedans in the world.

Tony Alonso

Speaking again of interior plastic, take a look at this Car Connection article on the '05 Focus. There is a photo of the dash and mention about the materials.

Kev, nice review...if you get a chance to take a look at a Maxima or 350Z sometime, I'd love to hear your opinion.

slp

From the 2005 Mustang Quick Reference Guide:

OPENING ALL WINDOWS (IF EQUIPPED)
The vehicle windows can be opened using the remote transmitter by pressing and holding the Unlock button. Additionally, the windows can be opened or closed using the key in the driver door key cylinder. For more information, please refer to your Owner s Guide.

mustangfun101

The new Motor Trend blast the 350Z interior in a open top comparison with the TT, Boxster S, and Z4. I also remember Nissan scrambling to do a first year redesign of the interior due to flaws and placement of equipment complaints by customers. I think Ford (from the looks of the interior layout) paid attention to focus groups, they usually do.

Tony Alonso

On the 350z, they re-did the lid that opens for the area where the navigation system goes and the seat belt attachment point but left much of it untouched. The other major interior item I recall is the cloth seat covers were wearing early and that there was service bulletin to deal with that.