bdunosk

This is based off of pictures I've seen, since I haven't been fortunate enough to be around an '05 just yet...

I was in a colleague's new 7-series BMW yesterday, and was quite surprised to see that the quality of the interior plastic is very similar to the new Chevy Malibu. In fact, the texture looks exactly like the '05 Mustang pictures - so what I'm wondering is what you people who have actually seen it think? That's only the third time I've been in a BMW in 27 years, so I don't know if any of the car guys here have a broader experience.

kevinb120

I think BMW has serious ***** asking what they ask for their cars.

bdunosk

In the past, no... nowadays, probably. I've never driven one, and evidently those who have say it's like multiple orgasms, but from riding in one I have to say that a lot of other manufacturers are closing the gap. I'm hoping the Mustang is part of this group.

Robert

My big worry is that - while the new Mustang has stepped up dramatically in quality - some of the plastics still look cheap. I can tell from the photos - the center console has that hard, pebble like plastic so often used by the domestic automakers.

Why they can't use higher quality materials, is frankly, beyond me. In this respect, they're still way behind the imports. It's sad when a modern domestic has equivalent or inferior build quality to a 20 year-old Japanese import! Or when a 1987 Toyota Supra can offer climate control, illuminated entry, headlight washers, etc, but the 2005 Mustang doesn't.

And I still haven't seen a compelling argument as to why I can order a sunroof, xenon headlights and NAV on a Mazda 3 (their subcompact bargain car), but not on Ford's Mustang - the blue oval's flagship sport coupe!

Regarding the BMW question: My friend has a 2001 740i Sport with the M series wheels and suspension (identical to the one Bond drove in Tomorrow Never Dies). It's a helluva car - every imaginable gadget and then some. It's bank-vault solid too, with doors that weigh more than some Korean sub compact cars, I'm sure! But it ought to, it's a 100K car!

Driving wise? Yeah, Bimmers drive nice; a number of the luxury car brands drive nice. In fact, he and I recently drove a 2004, 225 bhp V6 5-series sedan. Even though it was only a six, it went like stink and felt very secure and planted.

The automotive press certainly likes Bimmers for those very reasons. I mean, the M3 produces 300 bhp from a normally aspirated 6 cylinder! It does 0-60 in 4.8 seconds, which means it will still be faster than the new Mustang with its 300 bhp V8!

Unfortunately, Bimmers are expensive to repair and not without reliability issues. Still, here in Vancouver, every second or third car seems to be a BMW! People like 'em, or rather, people buy into the prestige of them!

New 7-series and Chevy Malibu having equivalent interior quality? Even though I don't care for the new Bangle design, particularly the new interiors, I think it's unlikely that a Chevy Malibu's interior could be on par with BMW's flagship sedan.

All that said, if the new '05 Mustang is really and truly as well built as the Mazda 6, I think we're in for a great car. :worship:

But it's frustrating - we used to build the best cars in the world here in North America. Now we're playing a perpetual game of catch up.

bdunosk

Well, that was really the big surprise for me when getting into his 7-series. The interior plastic was that huge-grain pebble stuff... the back of the front seats seemed to be plastic as well, which is the same thing GM has done with their new cars.

I think you see a lot more BMW's on the road now since leasing has become so popular. Or at least you down here in the states, I don't know about Canada.

ponyboy66

My 2 cents.
The automotive industry has gone through very rough quality issues over the last several years. Having said that, I have been in the plastics industry for 12 years. Automotive standards and requirements have become much better. As working for a company that actually manufactures parts for the new mustang (non visual). The requirements for this car are as close to impossible as it gets. We are holding tolerances on parts that were never heard of before this program. We started manufacturing parts in August of '03 and still do not have approval on some of them. We are close. Expecting final approval by the end of next week. The material requirements have never been used in this application, it has always been considered an overkill material. Now, I can't speak to the rest of the car, what I will say is this: If Ford is requiring such high standards on non-esthetic parts, don't you think that the fit and finish portion would be the same? I have not seen the car.
I do make parts for it and it is good to see a US automaker being so picky about quality. As a business person I have to say that Ford has been the toughest customer I have ever had to deal with in over 22 years. Not because they're idiots, but because they have VERY HIGH standards.

justgreat

uh...the 5 series doesn't have a v6...it's straight sixes only for bmw...one reason why their sixes are so smooth and make such big numbers.

regarding the quality of interior components in the mustang i brought this subject up repeatedly about a month ago...it's one of the sore spots for ford, imo...the mustang will be wildly popular even with inferior inteior components BUT when someone who has owned some of the imports and is shopping the mustang, if ford hasn't increased the quality of the plastics used it's going to be a hard sell.

as far as the mustang not having all the bells and whistles on the option list, all that was done to keep production costs down. anytime you add options to a car's order list it cost more on the bottom line. it drives me crazy that the ford will have a prop rod for the hood instead of struts...but struts are much more expensive to equip on a car over the rod.

let's hope that ford got it right this time and put the quality into the interior parts and build quality and left off the doodads. they can do it...i recall renting the first generation contour that was imported in the u.s. and was quite impressed with the inteior...every bit as nice as my wife's audi. BUT...on later versions of the contour, in order to save money, ford changed the plastics for the inteior and it was quite apparent...very noticeable the lack of quality all in the name of saving a buck.

it's definitely a fine line between a price point and quality expected by the consumer...especially hard for the mustang, where value is such a big component of selling the car. jackg 90seville 94k

mustangfun101

Hmmmm, Lotus Elise, around $40K, flag ship of it's company, almost no interior trim, almost no interior period. I think a Mustang with 300hp, mid-high 20K range, looks great, and comfortable, we are doing just fine. It's not a BMW, nor will it ever be, it's a Mustang. I like it that way.

Badandy

Why does every one of your posts have to deal with how the Mustang isn't as nice as BMW's?


Yup, they might. It is NOT that expensive of a car. There are tradeoffs.

Why is it beyond you? Can you not handle the fact that the Mustang GT blows away the Acura TSX in styling (IMO) and performance even though the TSX has a high quality interior? It is a tradeoff, what don't you understand that?


Here's an arguement: Ford didn't want to spend the money on implementing options that 2 percent of its customers would get.

Actually, it is 333 HP Inline Six, and it is also a 56-70k dollars! They charge so much money for that car, they have the money to invest loads in finetuning their engines to get all they can out of them.

I don't think it is catchup. It is a precedant. Come on imports, build a 300hp sedan with a nice interior and maybe over 320 torque, for 25k.

bdunosk

Wow, thanks for that inside information ponyboy66. That is huge... you're right, why spend so much time nitpicking on the little things if you're going to screw up the big ones. Something for us all to look forward to.

appaloosa

Yep I agree with the above assessment. I was originally a big Mustang fan. After 1970's I drifted off to other cars. Much later I got involved with Porsches and stayed with them for a while. I sold my last 944 Turbo sports car. So I started researching for my next candidate. At first the 993 was my next selection. However they are plagued with several factory related problems like wiring and weak suspensions. The 997 suffers from rear main seal malfunction which often requires an outright engine replacement. Next I looked at the M3 they are really nice cars as you already know. Without knowing all the details I picked up bad vibes about their reliability and maintenance expense much like Porsche. German cars may be king of the hill in the performance but at that price and hassle no thanks. I looked at the STi another great engineering. Unfortunately the visual design is a major turn off.

So now with the 2005 Mustang coming back to it's root. Brings me back home again with Ford Mustang. Better looking then all my previous prospects and much much easier on the wallet. I plan on staying here until the end.

Goodbye foreign sports cars! :flag2:

kevinb120

I keep saying: just a LITTLE boost in interior quality, driveability, and comfort-and tons of people will stop going to Accord Coupe, Solara, Eclipse, Sebring, RSX, Celica, etc. A LOT of thier customers WANTED Mustangs first. The new car has got it covered in spades.

dallasw77

Actually the imports are closer than you think, just take the Honda Accord, for 21-24k you get a V6 240hp. And they do have nice interiors, nothing spetacular but nice quality. I have 99 two dr model and it is very nice on the inside. IMO. But it comes down to what each particular individual wants and what each person likes/dislikes and how much $ they want to spend.

dallasw77

As added note, I agree with you Badandy on most of what you said. Plus comparing beemers to Mustangs is like comparing apples to oranges IMO. I guess the 318 series is how much? around 24k or so?
so maybe compare that version but is it a sports car? ohh well!

kevinb120

Actually the imports are closer than you think, just take the Honda Accord, for 21-24k you get a V6 240hp. And they do have nice interiors, nothing spetacular but nice quality. I have 99 two dr model and it is very nice on the inside. IMO. But it comes down to what each particular individual wants and what each person likes/dislikes and how much $ they want to spend. [/b][/quote]
They save their money by using LESS material everywhere, just enough metal and plastic to get by. They still do tend to take mfg shortcuts like multipiece stampings. They build it WELL, but if you REALLY look at the soup and nuts, they give you LESS car.

mustangfun101

Oh, and if you are on a budget, you consider bang for the buck. I also consider (some people don't until it's too late) how much per hour I'm paying for my Ford Mechanic instead of the BMW, Merc, Lexus, and Acura mechanics. Not to mention parts prices compared to the European companies. You can't touch the Mustang. The interior trim looks great in the 05 compared to the older car and most others. Styling of the interior looks alot better then some of the boring interiors of some euro-cars we have been talking about.

bdunosk

And don't forget the cost of gas... quite a few listed alternates require premium, which is about $0.20 / gallon more. Not huge, but certainly something else to think about.

Badandy

BTW


Lexus' never need to be repaired. From my experience they are rock solid and are VERY dependable. I don't know about Acura, but since it is a Honda, I would bet they are dependable too. But you are right on the BMW and Mercedes.

mustangfun101

All cars need serviced, those price differences alone can be significant. BTW, my friend has an 2003 IS300. It's in the shop more then my 97GT. I don't know anyone with an Acura. POINT IS, the interior is much better than it was in both looks of material and layout. CAN I GET AN AMEN?!??!?!

NolanzDad

I sat in an '05 in Foxborough,MA during the 40th tour stop. One of my "observations" was the "cheapness" of some of the plastic surfaces- the dash appeared OK, but the center console showed some "bubbling"...since this was a pre-production vehicle, I'm assuming this situation will be addressed prior to launch
(fingers crossed; lights votive candle).