duhler

My 289, 4bbl, 4 speed hurst has a problem.

Not every time, but most of the time, when I go to start the car, I get a sound like metal rubbing metal (not exactly, but it is close). It is not the clicking sound you hear when the battery is dead.

I believe it is the starter that is trying to go. The car usually will eventially start, but it may take several turns of the key before it tries to kick in. Usually, once it actually tries to kick in, it will start with no problem.

Assuming it is the starter/solenoid, is there a good website that will instruct me on replacing it/them in the '66 -- specifically, parts needed, etc.? Or do I just have to buy the book?

Thanks,

Doug

66HertzClone

Before you replace anything, check all the basic stuff first. Ford starters require a minimum of 10 1/2 volts at the starter to work. Remove the battery terminals, clean them, use a wire brush or sandpaper to insure a solid connection. Inspect the terminal ends, if the arms of the terminal are touching each other where the bolt passes thru, cut some of the lead away so there is a gap between them when they are tight on the battery post. When correctly installed the post of the battery should extend above the terminal end, so spread the arms as needed,position the terminal then tighten the bolt.

Check for a good solid ground at the engine, if there is paint in the area clean it off, if there is not one already there place a star washer between the terminal end of the cable and the block. Tighten securely.

Chech for a ground strap between the cylinder head (right side) and the firewall.

Be sure your battery is good and fully charged, if it has removable caps check the level of acid in it. Have someone else try and start the engine while you look into the battery cells. If while trying to engage the starter, a cell bubbles, the battery is no good. The bubbles indicate the connector between the cells has broken.

If after checking all these items you still have the same problem, purchase a new solenoid, it is far cheaper and easier to install than the starter. If the problem persists, remove the starter and have it checked at your local parts store. Most of the chains stores will do this for no charge.

As far as replacement of these items, neither is especially difficult, the solenoid has only the wires and two mounting bolts. Remove the negative cable from the battery BEFORE starting any replacement of these parts. Label or use a digital camera to insure you replace the wires back in the correct spots. The starter mounts with two bolts and has only one wire connection. It is heavy and is akward to remove, espicially when there are headers in the way. For these I don't think a manual is required, although you should get one for reference in the future. A factory service manual is the best bet, you can find them on ebay.

Good luck, Jeff

duhler

thanks!

duhler

Okay -- Had the battery tested and checked the terminals. Everything okay.

Next, I replaced the solenoid. I made sure I hooked it up exactly the same way. Upon replacement, I tried to start the car. I got the same exact noise I had before when the car would not start. One big difference, when I used the ignition to shut it off, it would not shut off. Until I unhooked the neg. terminal on the battery, it continued to run with the metalic rubbing sound.

Therefore, I put the old solenoid back on. I operates exactly the same way as before. It will start sometimes, but not every time. However, the ignition will shut it off when I shut it down.

Therefore, I conclude that I do need to replace the starter since I had the same sound regardless of which solenoid I used.

Any ideas of why the ignition would not shut the new solenoid down?

Thanks,

Doug

66HertzClone

One other possible problem comes to mind. The ignition switch itself. The noise you hear, does it sound like the starter is still going even after you release the key? It would also explain why the engine kept running after you turn the key off. Have you had this car a long time? Do you keep alot of keys on the key ring? The weight of a heavy key ring will wear both the lock cylinder (mechanical) and the ignition switch (electrical) over time. This can be checked with a test light or volt meter, difficult to explain, but somewhat easy to do. Since the problem is does not happen every time, it may take several tests to find the answer. I hope this helps, Jeff

duhler

The "noise" is a metalic sound, that sounds like it is coming from the starter. To clarify, the engine did not keep running when I tried to shut it off at the ignition, just the starter trying to engage kept going.

This only occured after putting on the new solenoid.

I am going to go ahead and try to replace the starter.

Thanks,

Doug

Skorch52

Sorry to come in late, but it sounds like the starter shaft isn't going all the way out and properly engaging with the flywheel. It may even be binding which doesn't allow it to disengage either.

duhler

I just hope that the starter hasn't damaged the flywheel!

duhler

Well, I replaced the starter and the solenoid. The only thing I figure out about the new solenoid is that it must be a reverse polarity to the original (of course, I can't find any distinguishing marks). Anytime I put it on, the starter will not disengage and I get sparks on the neg. side of the battery.

Therefore, I put the old solenoid back on. The start sounds great, but the flywheel would not engage. I, therefore, decided to replace the battery just to rule that out of the possibility. Even with the replaced battery, the starter will not engage the flywheel. I sounds like the flywheel is not even touching the teeth of the starter. At this point, I don't know if the guy at Advanced Auto Parts gave me the correct starter or not. If the flywheel is busted, I know I have a big repair bill coming!

If anyone has any other suggestions, I would appreciate it! Thanks for all suggestions up to this point.

Doug

StangerX

Just a little of my own experience on solenoids.... They are terrible. Good luck getting your hands on a good one. I had to go through 3 of them once just to get a working model. I've had the same thing happen to a friend with an 83 ranger. It uses the exact same solenoid as my car (66 stang), and he had the same problems. If you have problems with the solenoid, try a couple of them.

I know that doesn't help with the starter issue, but that's one piece.

As for the starter, did you get a good look at the flywheel when you put the new starter in? You should be able to see the teeth on the weel and inspect them for damage. Also, you should be able to check the clearance of the starter as you're putting it in.

My experiences with folks at advance and autozone is that they don't know crap about these cars. If it's not in their computer, they can't figure it out. I usually find a more experienced (less ricey) autoparts store like Napa or a really solid local chain we have here that knows their stuff and actually uses BOOKS to find the parts.

My thoughts are that the starter might be bubkiss. Double check your old starter (if you haven't cored it already) to see if it still works the same as before. Perhaps compare the old and new starters to make sure they look the same. If you already cored it in, I would recomend going to a different parts store with the new starter and checking it against what they pull for you.

Good luck.

duhler

Thanks again,

If I had a NAPA store . . . I don't know of any around this town. The only auto parts store that I can find are the Advanced and Autozone. There is an "O'Reily's", but I know nothing about them.

When I had the start off, I looked at what was visible with the flywheel (I did not move it or anything like that, but will when I take the new starter back off). I didn't see any damage or teeth missing.

The only real noticable piece different in the two starters is that the gear in the old starter appears to be out of metal, while the new appears to be some type of hard plastic. When I take the new starter back off, I will look at it closer to make sure I got the same size gear and all. To me, since it sounds like the new starter is just turning, that the gear in the new starter is not the right size and is not touching the flywheel.

Thanks again!

GT350Clone

You might find this interesting.... :scratch:

duhler

That thread just described everything to a Tee!!!

Thanks for your help!

Now to find the time to take the "new" starter off and take it back to Advanced Auto Parts.

Doug

Zachary.Rodriguez09

I'm having the same problem but I didn't replace the solenoid and it's making that same grinding noise/ metallic noise from the starter.