2014 Mustang GT Engine tick/knock
 

Hi all,

I've written on this before in other posts but I wanted to share with everyone a summary history of my engine tick troubles.

So here’s how things happened up till now:

1. Bought the car and about 2000 miles into ownership, I heard the engine tick
2. Reported engine tick to selling dealer
3. Selling dealer Mak Hiek heard the noise and said it was normal
4. I disagreed
5. Mak Hiek advised that the Ford tech hotline said the noise is normal, new cars on their lot had the same noise and other customers are reporting the noise. They say that due to this, the noise is normal.
6. So I take the car to Griffith Ford ( dealer number 2 ). They agree to diagnose the noise so they called Ford and were directed to remove drive belt. Noise remained. Canceled Cylinder number one, noise stopped. Then they proceeded to rebuild the lower end of the engine. It took 2 months for the troubleshooting/rebuild to finish ( they had more important things to do than deal with my car )
7. After the engine was rebuilt I changed the oil about 4 months and 2k-3k miles later at Covert Ford ( dealer number 3 ) and the noise came back. I discovered the noise on the same day as the oil change was done.
8. About 5 days later I went back to Covert where the oil change was done and showed 2 people the noise. They agreed to have me leave the car there to investigate. This was on a Saturday.
9. The following Monday they called me back and said that Ford wasn’t going to authorize any further repairs on the engine and wouldn’t give me any documentation for the visit. The dealer said ‘Ford told us not to write it up and that it’s on file with Ford’ and to go to the BBB.
10. As a result of the BBB interaction a Ford engineer came out to inspect the car. The engineer heard the noise and even had a concerned look on his face a couple of times when he heard it. Yet, he said he wasn’t going to authorize any further repairs because he doesn’t feel like the car will leave me stranded.
11. I disagreed with his decision and took the car home
12. I later called Covert back and offered to pay him to do the troubleshooting that was done at Griffith Ford the first time this issue happened. Covert service manager said that he had to run this by the engineer. Once done the service manager called me back and said he didn’t feel there was anything to troubleshoot. Which I knew was a lie because he told me on the phone that he wanted to go into the engine but Ford wouldn't pay him. This was on that Monday when they told me to go to the BBB.
12. Waited for BBB to set an arbitration date. Never got one for about 3 weeks of waiting so I withdrew from that process.
13. Contacted a lawyer and awaiting advice.

Here's the engine noise that is occurring after the last oil change:

I'll get back with more when I have updates.

Anyone that sees this thread please re-tweet:

2014 Mustang GT Engine tick/knock
 

Sounds like Ford is giving you the run around. Check with your states Lemon Law, dealers are typically required by law to give you a repair order paperwork when you take your car in for a repair. You will probably get ford to buy back your vehicle if you have all the required documentation. However, once you get a lawyer involved, Ford will not make any repair attempts on your vehicle until the case is over.

I have a similar issue on my 14 GT. Only does it when the AC is on though.

Judging from the dealers you took it to. It sounds like you're in the Austin area? Not sure which Covert you took the car. I'm guessing the one on 183 in Austin? If so, you may want to try their other dealership in Hutto. I've had good experiences with their service department in the past.

Thank you for your reply.

I have a stack of paper work all totaling up to 140 days day in the shop for various issues including the engine. They really should have done a short block the first time. After reading other experiences compared to mine, short blocks have been more successful. Them rebuilding my engine seems to be an exception to the standard.

I have a couple angles to work here and I'll get back with updates.

Thanks for the post. I'm in the Austin area and the dealer who denied me paper work was Covert Ford Hutto. Sadly. Dunno what they have to hide.

Don't let the AC deceive you. My tick happens under a few conditions:

1. Happens when: engine at operating temp, AC on, engine at idle, car in drive or reverse. Either turning the ac off or putting trans in neutral stops the noise.

2. Happens when: AC off and engine at operating temperature and if you start off accelerating about 1/4 throttle along side fence or a wall with the passage side window rolled down facing against said wall. You get the same noise as above only amplified by like a factor of 3. Clatter clatter clatter. It's very loud and embarrassing.

Proceed with caution when troubleshooting this one :)

And I fixed another issue with the car. I replaced my rear upper control arm today. The one above the rear differential. Bought the factory control arm new and had a 3rd party install it. Won't even try to get a dealer to do these small things anymore.

Replacing this arm solved a couple of issues :)

1. I could feel a vibration from the rear of the car and it was making it's way up through the steering wheel. It felt like the drive shaft carrier support was about to explode. Solved.

2. It solved an issue where if I would hit half throttle coming out of a curve the car would feel like it was hesitating. Like the engine wouldn't let it go forward and accelerate and it felt like the car was about to start hopping. The rear end felt like it was about to break in half it was binding so bad.

3. We have sloped road in Texas. Say for example I drive straight and the road was sloped down to my right the car would try to walk up the slope slightly to the left instead of feeling like I had to hold the wheel counter to the slope slightly to stay straight. In other words, it wanted to go up the slope by-itself. Felt kind of like torque steer. Solved.

4. This also dramatically improved steering feel overall. For example, before the control arm was replaced, I would feel like there was some disconnect. Like I had to move the wheel very far to do normal things. This only happened while the car was moving. Now I barely have to move it to get it to do what it's supposed to do. The car is a lot more predictable and stable.

A lot of these symptoms were discovered early on, probably within the 1st week of ownership. Just never was able to get the understanding needed to solve them till a fellow from Christian Brothers automotive showed me some cracks in the upper control arm bushing rubber. He did me a good service there. They installed the arm for me today and the car is completely changed, for the better.

About a month ago they helped me install a transmission mount and drive shaft that I bought from Ford. These 2 items solved a bunch of other symptoms together, including very firm shifts/clunks in 2nd gear and very harsh downshifts. Feels/shifts correctly now. I'm loving that.

Just need to get this engine fixed now.

2014 Mustang GT Engine tick/knock
 

The way you have described your engine tick is exactly what mine did before I had the AC stretchy belt removed and replaced with a normal tensioner pulley.

Has you dealer performed the TSB 12-8-14 on your car?

http://cdn.lrsstatic.com/downloads/t...sb12-08-14.pdf

After a few trips to different dealers I printed out the TSB and took it with me and showed it to the service manager before it finally got fixed.

Thanks for the post...

I'm aware of the TSB. That's why I asked the dealership to troubleshoot the issue, by removing the drive belt. They have refused to do so even after offering them the thing they worship, MONEY. My noise is very possibly the TSB but I can't get ANY1 TO HELP ME OUT WITH IT! :dunno:

Have you reached out to Deysha? She is an awesome person at fordcustomerservice who helps escalate when normal avenues fail.

I've already heard from her 'highest point of contact'. This resulted in the Ford 'Engineer' coming out to inspect the car only to tell me the same thing the dealerships do 'there's nothing wrong with your car' with the car clattering the whole time.

Thanks for the mention, DarrenGT! However, once he has consulted legal counsel, I'm not able to communicate with him.

Deysha

2014 Mustang GT Engine tick/knock
 

You might want to ask Ford for lemon buy back papers. What state are you in? I went through the whole lemon/magnusson-moss process and it will take a long time when you involve lawyers. Could just ask Ford to buy back your vehicle since you aren't getting anywhere with a fix.

I was going through the BBB process but I withdrew because I never got an arbitration date. They kept telling me 'we're still waiting for the local BBB to get a date'. They said this for almost a month.

The lawyers I've contacted so far aren't being very responsive. :dunno:

I just called the 1-800-Lemon-Law number. The lady on the phone asked me to describe my issues, when I bought the car, when the issues started, etc. Once I gave that information she stated that she thinks I have case. She then asked me if I would like to be represented by their firm. If you say yes, they send you out this packet of information to which you fill out and return. You are then represented by them. They file the court documents and everything.

I didn't pay a penny out of pocket for all of this. My lawyer would never respond to emails. Maybe try calling if you haven't done so already?

Already sent my papers to one lemon lawyer and they said they couldn't help me. Something about not being the 3rd time for the repair.

Anyways, just went to http://www.lemonlaw.com/ and filled out their form. Let's see what happens.

updates.

I got a hold of the technician that did the first engine rebuild for me and he said he'd look at my car. He was a technician at the time of the rebuild but now he's the service manager. I don't fault him or that dealer for the situation I'm in. They did what Ford told them to do under warranty and they did a job that the selling dealer wouldn't do ( troubleshooting my engine noise ). If Ford would have sent a short block the first time we probably wouldn't be here right now.


Let's see what happens. I'm going to pay them to do the troubleshooting because I want the credit for this troubleshooting decision. This will help with credibility in court if we have go there.

2014 Mustang GT Engine tick/knock
 

That will get you your 3rd repair attempt as well. Good luck!

Updates:

My car is now at the dealership that rebuilt the motor the first time. We duplicated the noise.

I'm currently awaiting the results from removing the AC compressor belt ( to see if the noise goes away )

Sounds like the stretchy belt issue I've heard in other youtube videos.

I believe it is too, subject to troubleshooting. The trouble with my case is that I was being refused troubleshooting services under warranty at the near by dealership. Now that I've offered the right dealership payment for the troubleshooting, maybe we can get somewhere.

Griffith Ford in San Marcos got back with me today. They advised that removing the AC belt stopped the noise. They're waiting to see if Ford corp. will cover the TSB under warranty since the TSB is for 2011/2012.

Seriously? Wouldn't they incorporate the TSB into production? That is strange.

There's a part of the TSB that recommends the new engine cover for engines before a certain manufacture date. After that date, the TSB calls for no replacement engine cover and says to clean some items and install some new oil cooler tubes of some kind. These 2 tubes are right over 1000 dollars each, according to Griffith Ford. Just found this out about 2 hours ago as Griffith called me back again and said Ford is not recommending TSB 12-8-14 for my car due to the year models recommended in the TSB. I showed them a video I found on Youtube of a customer getting TSB 12-8-14 done on his 2013. Found here:
Griffith Ford is opening a case with Ford to ask why the TSB doesn't apply to the 2013 and 2014, when removing the A/c belt makes the noise go away, just like what happens when you do the same to the 2011s and 12's.

Heck, maybe I just have a bad and/or noisy A/c compressor. That, or The TSB needs to be changed once proven it's needed on 2013 and 14s.

Looks like I'm the guinea pig.

Maybe the lawyers can help me out of this mess, as my car has already been in the shop for over 140 days total since owned and I'm out about 1800 dollars in rental cars and after having to replace the drive shaft, rear lower control arms, rear center control arm and transmission mount on my own because of defect. All of which solved a bunch of issues on their own. Imagine all these are all bad at the same time and they send you home 'nothing wrong with your car'. Except now, I can prove it as I have all the old parts and can put them all right back on the car to demonstrate the symptoms these bad parts caused.

2014 Mustang GT Engine tick/knock
 

Running into a similar issue with my 14. My local Dealer cannot get the TSB covered to fix my car. So if I want it fixed I have to pay for it. Ford Customer Service told me I had to take it to another Dealer. My next nearest Dealer is an hour one direction away...

Thanks for the reply. Sounds like the Ford service norm now.

Maybe it's time for a class action.

Updates:

Heard back from Griffith Ford. They said Ford will not cover the TSB for my car. No alternate recommendations were given.

How can we troubleshoot the noise successfully and there not be a solution under warranty?

Griffith is willing to do the TSB under customer pay however.

Updates:

Griffith Ford installed the tensioner under customer pay and we learned the reason why the TSB calls for the update transmission cooler tubes. The old tubes get in the way of the new belt config.

For now, we're just going to move the tubes out of the way and brace them and try to duplicate the noise while the new tensioner is on there. If the noise goes away, bam. Now we can ask Ford to look into updating TSB 12-8-14 to see if 2013 and 2014 cars can be added.

We're not doing the tubes yet since they're over 1100 dollars each ( according to Griffith )

Why do I feel like I'm doing Ford's job for them? They already denied the TSB under warranty even AFTER pulling the belt stopped the noise.
With every passing week, I prove more and more Ford's inability to make responsible warranty repair decisions.

Their credibility in court, if I have to go there, would be next to zero at this point. All I have to do is install all the old defective parts and prove it all.

2014 Mustang GT Engine tick/knock
 

Removed the AC belt on my car last week. That is how the new Dealer wanted to start diagnosis. My noise is 98% gone. It has been so wonderful driving the car with the noise not there! It still ticks very slightly on light acceleration randomly. But it is SO much quieter and only happens once or twice. The Service Manager is sending in a tech request. Then we will proceed from there. For now I am driving without the AC belt. Which is glorious since the noise is so infrequent now. Then we can work on getting the last little bit of noise figured out.

hey thanks for getting back. It will be very interesting to see if they will cover the TSB for you. Can you let me know what happens? I want it out in the open if there are any variations between your case and mine.

Thanks again.

2014 Mustang GT Engine tick/knock
 

I will let you know. But because the Dealer I am now working with is an hour away from me it will be awhile. The next time I can miss work will probably be after labor day.

Updates:

Got the car back.

The noise appears to be gone after getting rid of the stretchy belt and putting the tensioner system on.

I had to pay for it but I will be seeking action against Ford for my case. I will also seek legal advice to see if we can have Ford extend TSB 12-8-14 to 2013 and 2014 cars.

I have to give props to Griffith Ford in San Marcos, they listened to me.

When they removed the belt and the noise stopped, they contacted Ford with the feedback and Ford offered no assistance.

I'm going to ask Griffith Ford to: feedback my fact that the TSB solved the noise. Let's see what they come back with.

Nice to see it fixed!

Thanks SpectreH!

I will let you all know if I can get a an answer from Ford regarding expanding the TSB. If they don't want to talk about it, then on behalf of myself and all Mustang 5.0 stretchy belt owners, I will file with the law.

How much was the repair? Parts/labor? Mine does it sometimes...might install myself since my warranty is up. Also, would have to make sure it would not interfere with the ProCharger I installed.

SpectreH,

My total was 388.46 for the TSB.

The tensioner gets in the way of some transmission cooling lines. These cooling lines are pretty expensive. They quoted them to me for around 1100 each.

However, they found a way to bend and clamp the current lines and they're out of the way and safe right now. I'm planning on replacing them though if I can get any traction on the legal path I'm taking.

The tube part numbers are:

CR3Z-7R081-C
CR3Z-7R081-D
full parts list here:
http://cdn.lrsstatic.com/downloads/t...sb12-08-14.pdf

Just added up all my expenses for all the parts I've had to replace on my own because Ford is incompetent and/or fraudulent:

Rental car from 8/4/2015 through 8/25/2015 1322.29 ( while we waited for Ford to find out they didn’t want to do their jobs for my engine tick )
TSB 12-8-14 performed parts and labor: 388.46 ( engine tick solved )
Front lower control arms parts and labor: 638.12 ( steering wheel shimmy and road walking solved )
Motor mounts: 529.95 ( slightly excessive power train movement felt during 2nd gear shifts remaining after a trans mount replacement solved a server thud, solved )
Alignment after the control arms replaced: 89.95
Tax: 55.30
Total: 1701.78

Previous costs:
Drive shaft and transmount replaced, parts labor and rentals: 960.72 ( vibration and a very severe 2nd gear shift thud solved )
Rear-center control arm parts and labor: 421.30 ( solved a shaking coming from the rear end )
Body panels alignments: 585.20
Rear differential service due to slip disks not slipping correctly from warranty flub ( incorrect friction modifier in my oil after the differential was rebuilt, solved ): 221.30
Rear lower control arms parts and labor: 345.50 ( solved a vibration and very harsh rear road walk issue )

My out of pocket Grand Total: 4235.80.

My car is now doing a lot better as the replacement parts are working very well.

One more issue to fix: I have a rear differential noise that I will be proving as defect very soon. I will have back lash and pinion pre-load spec numbers soon from a 3rd party. It’s been rebuilt before by mak haik Ford but they flubbed it up. Griffith Ford fixed the issues caused by mak haik. Unfortunately however, as time has gone by, noise from there has gotten louder since it was never done right the 1st time and it still needs attention. It makes a very loud ringing and whining noise. Especially on decelerations. I've been correct about everything else so I'm very confidant either the back lash or pinion pre-load spec numbers will be off/out-of-spec. Maybe both.

2014 Mustang GT Engine tick/knock
 

Glad your noise is fixed! I am still driving without my AC belt. My dealer is still trying to get approval to do the TSB. I will let you know how it goes. It is truly glorious not having the constant noise on acceleration. I still have a very slight tick I will address with my Dealer. But it is SO few and far between. I heard it just a couple times in a hour long drive. Where as with the belt it would have happened at every light. And w/o the belt it is much quieter and fewer actual ticks. The lines you are talking about are for the automatics only for those who are curious.

Thanks for getting back, friend. Looking forward to hearing back from you. If they approve the TSB for you, that just further proves neglect in my own case.

Hopefully you'll hear back soon and get ur A/C back with no noise :)

Good call on the variation of the tubes as they relate to transmission type.

2014 Mustang GT Engine tick/knock
 

I will let you know. At this point I too will pay for it if I have to. The driving experience is just SO much better.

Thanks for the update. I hope they take care of you. It looks like you have the dealer on your side, time for corporate to step up to the plate.

This is exactly why I'm fighting so hard. I crave driving this car and I know exactly how they're supposed to feel. I'm making up reasons to drive it again.

Thank you. Yes, Griffith Ford did put the replication of the noise and the troubleshooting steps done in writing for me. Unlike sneaky Covert Ford and Ford's "engineer" that came out.

I won't be giving up any time soon. They will answer for their poor decisions.

Had my appointment at my next nearest Dealer as requested per Ford Customer Service. I took a day Vacation and drove the hour one way to the Dealer. Things are still in the process of what can be done on the noise. Anyone else have any news on their cars?

I have 2014 GT 13800 miles and have the tick. Local dealer just advised its a carbon build up, advised good quality 87 octane fuel and use Seafoam for next couple of tank fulls. So far the tick sounds more prominent. I will do my part on the fuel. Dealer advised against 91/93 octane fuel. I plan to keep all of my fuel receipts and note the Seafoam use. Will keep you posted

Stil still present after two tanks of Shell 87 fuel with Seafoam. Car runs fine will probably let it go until something happens should be covered under warranty.

It's been a a couple months since you reported that your noise has vanished. I'm looking into a 14 with the same noise. Can you confirm that fix is still going strong. Thank you.

Finally heard back from the BBB. They're making Ford buy my car back. I don't know the buy back amount yet as that is set by Ford. If I'm not satisfied with the amount, I can dispute it through the BBB. I'm hoping to know within the next couple days what the final number is.

Alright guys,

After being in touch with a lemon lawyer and the BBB, I finally received my buy back number from Ford and it is somewhat satisfactory. The number recovers around 85% of my financial losses and it pays off the car which I will soon return to the selling dealer. I've accepted the offer. The final figure actually includes buy back for the original price of the car ( minus the rebate ) and reimbursement for a majority of the money I've spent fixing the car. The drive shaft for example.

The way it worked in my case is the BBB inspected the car in order to replicate the current issues I'm having with it then they made the decision in my favor and ruled to have Ford buy the car back. Now, the BBB just makes the buy back decision and does not calculate the buy back amount. Ford calculates the buy back amount. It appears however that customers are able to dispute the buy back amount offered by Ford. They did negotiate with me on the buy back amount until I was able to get a majority of my losses back.

One thing that I learned that I think you all should know. If you ever have a lemon case with Ford and want to go to court, in most cases, you have to get a arbitration decision first from the BBB BEFORE you can file a lawsuit. It seems we're allowed to reject or accept that BBB decision and if rejected, you can then potentially file with a lawsuit.

Below is a list of warranty repairs and parts that I have replaced on my own, with explanation for replacing those parts.

1. The rear differential was rebuilt by selling dealer Mac Haik Ford Georgetown
The differential was rebuilt due to a deceleration vibration that could be felt on decel from anything above 40 MPH. The issues was so bad that the steering wheel shimmied from the vibrations coming up the drive line. ( put your foot back on the gas then the shimmy went away to a certain extent )
They also had to replace the slip clutches and a few bearings. I knew the clutches were bad since my car was acting like it was one-wheel drive ( told them this and they didn't believe me at first but they finally did rebuild it ) - we also replaced the drive shaft first but that didn't solve the shaking in this early instance of shaking - it was a guess to replace the drive shaft in this instance.

2. Unfortunately Mac Haik Ford Georgetown didn't do a good job on the rear diff. It was very loud after the rebuild. Took it down to Griffith Ford San Marcos and they fixed the problem. Pinion pre-load was way loose at 5 inc. lbs

3. The engine was rebuilt due to the infamous 5.0 tic. This was done at Griffith Ford within the same visit as their rear differential repair. The car was at Griffith from 8-26-14 through 10-30-2014. They had better things to do then to work on my car. The engine tic was reported to the selling dealer but they said the noise was 'normal' because they had other customers reporting the noise, new cars on their lost had the same noise, and their Ford hotline was telling them the noise is normal. The engine rebuild consisted of replacing the crankshaft, number 1 connecting rod and all cap and crank bearings. Engine tic was gone but only for a while. I will go into that later. I'm upset with the amount of time it took but I am grateful that they were willing to do a job that Mac Haik Ford Georgetown refused to do and also corrected the rear dif mistakes they made.

4. The rear lower control arms were replaced ( customer pay ). These were replaced due to a symptom where the car would go over certain bumps, it would shim/wobble and caused increased steering effort. After going to 2 Firestones to have it checked out, I finally learned what the problem's cause was. The 2nd Firestone dealer put the car on a lift and then used a crow bar to find slack in the rear suspension bushing. He checked the 4 lower control arm bushing + the upper control arm large bushing. The tech found one bad bushing. It was the passenger side forward lower control arm bushing. He brought me into the bay and showed me how he found it and showed me the difference in the slack in that bushing as compared with the almost non existent slack in the rest of the lower control arm bushing. The tech was also concerned about the upper control arm large bushing as there were some small cracks in the rubber. So after all this was found I reported my findings to Sames Ford in Bastrop since San Marcos Ford was 'done with me'. I reported to them just the single bad bushing. Took the car too them and left it. They called me back 'there's nothing wrong with your car'. I said 'are sure because we found the bad bushing at Firestone'. They said they'd talk to their foreman. They called me back again and said they put the car on a lift a drove it and found nothing wrong but wanted me to come and show them. I said 'no I can't come up there right now just order the control arms and I'll pay for them' 'I need this done!'. So they did and I picked up the car and that issue was solved.

5. The front lower control arms were replaced twice. Once due to the TSB and once under customer pay. Sames Ford did the first set under TSB. Picked up the car and things seemed to be ok but I still noticed a slight steering wheel shimmy which got progressively worse. Over time it got real bad. So I got to researching and I found out that when you install these lower control arms, you have to torque the control arm nuts while the suspension is under normal load. So thinking that Sames Ford may have overlooked that, I paid Griffith Ford to replace the control arms again and had them make sure they did the nuts while under load ( yes Griffith would see me if I paid and this was almost a year after the rebuild they did on the engine ). This finally resolved the specific steering wheel shimmy that was caused by the damaged bushings. My decision to replaced them again was based upon the assumption that Sames didn't install them correctly. The OEM front lower control arms that Griffith installed are working just fine to this day.

6. Drive shaft was replaced due to a shaking/vibration throughout the car. The center carrier was toast. I found the slack after I took the car to a 3rd party shop and they showed me the slack in the slotted rubber within the center support bracket. So I took the car to Covert Ford Hutto as I had moved to Round Rock Texas. I explained to them the shaking and the slack I found while on a lift. They inspected the car and called me back 'nothing wrong with you car'. So I picked up the car and took the car to Riata Ford. Same story, 'nothing wrong with my car'. So I bought a drive shaft from them and took the car to Christian Brothers automotive and they installed the drive shaft for me. Car felt smoother but still not exactly right. The remaining vibration was coming from the rear center control arm. I'll go into that later.

7. At the same time I order the drive shaft, I also ordered a transmission mount because in addition to the drive shaft shake, I was also getting very harsh shifts in certain situations. Especially in 2nd gear. I could literally feel the power train moving around. The tech at Christian Brothers reported to me that the new mount caused the transmission to actually sit a little high up compared with the old one. Thereby further proving I was justified in replacing this mount. The harsh shifts and power train movement was resolved to an extent.

8. After the trans mount and drive shaft were replaced, I still had some vibration left over. I got to researching the rear upper control arm and started to understand it's job. I bought a new OEM upper control arm with bushing and had Christian Borthers install it. This resolved the remaining vibrations felt from the drive line.

9. Motor mounts - I replaced these under customer pay because there was still some power train movement left over after replacing the transmission mount. Couldn't notice the motor mount movement that well till the transmission mount was replaced. Once the motor mounts were replaced, all the power train movements stopped. All the mounts are tight now.

10. The engine tic came back after the 1st oild change was done after the engine rebuild. The oil change was done at Covert Ford Hutto. After I got the car back from the oil change I noticed the tick. Took it back to Covert Ford Hutto and they heard the noise and agreed to have me leave the car there for troubleshooting. They called me back after a weekend and told me Ford isn't going to approve anymore repairs on the engine. I disputed this through the BBB so Ford sent out an engineer who heard the noise but proceeded to tell me 'there's nothing wrong with the car'. I did some research and then called back Covert Ford and asked them if I could pay them to remove the A/C belt to see if the noise goes away. They said they had to run that by the Ford engineer. They did then called me back and said no they wouldn't do it because they feel there's nothing to fix. I proceeded to disengage from them and the BBB process. I called up the mechanic at Griffith Ford who had previously removed the belt as a troubleshooting step before he rebuilt my motor. I offered to pay Griffith Ford to remove the belt to see if the noise goes way and would potentially pay them for TSB 12-8-14. They called me back and reported that the noise did go away after removing the belt. I advised them to share the results with Ford. I think about 2 weeks went by then they came back and said Ford has no solution and that TSB 12-8-14 doesn't apply to the 2013 and 2014 car. So I thought to myself, 'how can it not apply? My 2014 car has the same stretchy belt that the 11 and 12 cars have'. So I advised Griffith Ford to install the tensioner and new belt. The noise is now solved, to this day.

11. Since replacing all of the above I started noticing a strange sensation coming from the rear. Kind of like how when live axles hop over bumps but to a very harsh extreme on this specific car. So I got to thinking to myself, the only thing left back there are shocks, springs and panhard bar. So I order a panhard bar since I wasn't ever concerned about the shocks or springs, replaced the panhard bar and resolved that issue.

12. Rear dif rebuilt again under customer pay - I found some more noise with it when I put the seat down when transporting the drive shaft I bought that one time mentioned above. I heard a pretty loud whining with the seat down, especially while decelerating from 10 miles per hour. Put the seat back up and was still able to hear it, but obviously harder to hear at that point. Rolled down the window and could also hear it against walls and such. The gear installer found that the backlash was at 12 thousandths and the pre-load was at 4 in. lbs. Ordered a gear install kit and new gears and they set the preload to 26 in. lbs. and backlash to 10 thousandths and rear differential noise is now within acceptable level ( you can hardly hear it now ). They also found browned clutches and replaced those along with excessive metal bits in the oil. They're thinking the reason for the browned clutches is because there was too much friction modifier installed. ( they're probably right because I had the rear diff serviced after Griffith Ford touch it and this solved an issue where the clutches were making the rear hop around during parking lot spot back outs ). The rear differential service fixed the hopping issue after some time of breaking in but unfortunately that service was possibly too late and that's why they found browned clutches.

Conclusions: I firmly believe that the significant slack from the rear passenger side lower control arm forward bushing caused significant stress and/or damage to the upper control arm, panhard bar, the drive shaft carrier, the transmission mount and ultimately the motor mounts. Remember, they're ALL CONNECTED to each other. I was thinking at first that it was just a severe manufacturing quality problem with all rubbers on the car but then I added it all up and thought to myself 'well, the OEM parts are designed to last and there doesn't seem to be a systemic issue with the parts so they must have been over-stressed from the rear lower control arm bushing that was bad. This is why I feel I'm right about this conclusion. I've had a few of these cars and didn't have to replaced any of these parts on those cars. I firmly feel to this day that something is bent within the power train/drive line as my drive shaft carrier is now currently toast again. Even more so than the original drive shaft. There's a horrible shaking feeling in the car right now but different so since the power train is so tight now, due to the new mounts.
In the end, Ford calculated a somewhat appropriate buy back number and I feel that they did this based off a potentially correct comprehension of my issue and trust in me as a technical minded customer. I appreciate the fact that they are reimbursing me for most of the money I've spent fixing the above items and buying the car back. I still have serious concerns over their warranty system but ultimately my issue as a whole is resolved. Thank you to my lemon lawyer, the BBB and the decision maker at Ford who obviously comprehended my issue correctly.

Current issues with the car:
-the drive shaft carrier went to mush again ( shaking came back ) Didn't have this issue with previous cars.
-the front passenger side strut is bad ( makes noise and fails the bounce test while the driver's side does not fail the bounce test )
-it has a severe bump steer problem. It will even bump steer at parking lot speeds over the very slightest of bumps. The BBB drove the car and agreed there was an issue. It drives horribly at the moment. I took the car to Christian Brothers and asked them to check the camber and toe during ride height changes. I have the numbers of the front end ride height changes below:

Pulling the car down ( I think they did 6 inches ) results in:
Driver's side camber changes from -1.1 at base ride height to -1.3 at neg 6 inches ride height ( probably normal )
passenger side camber changes from -1.0 at base ride height to -1.1 at neg 6 inches ( probably normal )

Total toe goes from .11 at base ride height to .02 at neg 6 inches ( I don't think this is normal but will reserve judgement for an expert )

Lifting the ride height by a mere 3/4's inch from it's base of 6 and a half inches results in the following changes:

Driver's side camber changes from -1.1 at base ride height to -1.0 when raising the car by only 3/4's of an inch ( not so concerned with this )
Passanger side camber changes from -1.0 at base ride height to -0.7 when raising the car by only 3/4's of an inch ( this to me indicates a strut or strut mount problem )

Total toe goes from .11 to .18 when raising ride height by 3/4's of an inch

By the time the ride height is changed by the special lift by 2 inches, we get the following readings:

Driver's side camber changes from -1.1 at base ride height to -0.1 when raising the car by 2 inches
Passenger side camber changes from -1.0 at base ride height to +0.2 when raising the car by 2 inches

Total toe goes from .11 at base then to .46 at + 2 inches ride height. ( this is the bump steer I'm feeling in the car and will be worse depending on which wheel is hitting a bump )

The passenger side tire is showing horrendous outside cupping while the rest of that tire is ok.

The passenger side camber changes from -1.0 at base ride height to +0.2 when raising the car by 2 inches with the total toe change to me, confirms a bump steer problem. Probably made worse by a bad strut and strut mount on the passenger side as both the passenger side strut and strut mount are making noise. The drivers side ones aren't making any noise.

In closing, although this situation was very stressful, it was not my fault. I have grown in knowledge and experience from this issue as a whole and I'm somewhat glad it happened. I'm a better person because of it.


Thank you to everyone who has read my post and supported me with their words.

Jesus Christ. My car (2014 Track Pack GT) is currently at my local dealer for its second rear end rebuild. I don't have nearly as long as a saga as you did, but I feel like I'm going down that road.

Unlike you, I'm fine with replacing factory crap with better aftermarket parts, but this time Ford (corporate) made me remove all my aftermarket suspension so they could rule out any of that causing the noises and vibrations from the rear end. Obviously they didn't believe me when I said the noises were there before I added the aftermarket parts, which were my attempts to make sure the geometry was all within spec after I lowered it with H&R Supersport springs.

I'll keep an eye on this thread. I do love my car, but I won't go down that road. We have our second child due in March, so it's already selfish enough for me to keep this car with two babies. If it starts looking like this is going to be how things are with these 13-14s, I'll just trade it in. It's already on stock suspension anyways. :shame:

Thanks for the post!

Yea...those rear differential issues seems to be a frequent item. If your 2nd rebuild comes back with issues, I would recommend getting a different brand of gear and a different installer. Make the installer tell you the back lash and preload numbers so that they know you're watching. Make sure you use the Ford part numbers for the pinions bearings ( I learned a lesson there ).

I know what you mean about telling them 'the problem was there before X Y and Z'. I've been there and they didn't believe me either. I end up proving my issue every time. The Ford dealers seem to be nothing short of mentally disabled at this point. Ford example, with the rear lower control arms issue. Firestone did me an excellent service and found the issue then educated me on the problem while Ford wasn't even able to find the issue. See that? Is a complete reverse when you go to a Ford dealer. Firestone put the car on the lift and did the inspection for FREE!!! I wanted to pay them but they wouldn't let me. I was trying to find the issue for 8 months!!!

I don't feel that the design of the 2013 and 2014s is bad. I do believe Ford has a slight manufacturing quality problem however. In my case, I believe that the rear control arms created a cascading effect in the drive line and power train that does not normally happen.

Thanks again and I hope your repairs go well. If you have a dispute, get with the BBB. I had good results here with them.

My local dealer rebuilt the rear end the first time, so it's all Ford parts. This will be their second attempt, though I know they are having different techs work on it this time.

It sort of worked out for me anyways, since I had a buddy get a 2014 GT also, so we just swapped over all our suspension (plus cash of course), as I have had an Air Lift kit waiting to go on the car since last September.

My car was there a week already with them trying to adjust the backlash and pinion angle to get the noise to go away, before the finally just decided to rebuild it again. They've had multiple hotlines open to Ford FSEs trying to figure it out. I planned on doing a CF driveshaft eventually too, so if this doesn't work out, I'll just take it to a performance shop and have the rear end rebuilt right, and buy all my BMR stuff again. It's funny I have 17k miles on my car, and have not had any issues with the front LCAs, nor the engine tick. I've only had 2 oil changes, and both with the Motorcraft 5W-50 synthetic blend, so I guess I'll keep it that way.

One thing to consider though, I swapped to high flow cats pretty early in the life of the car. Their diameter is probably 60-70% less than the stock cats, and since they flow more, I'm assuming they run cooler too - the front LCA bushings were getting cooked by the stock cats. I'm wondering if my high flow cats saved my stock LCA bushings... :dunno: I also don't have the metal shields on my LCAs, so they're not the updated parts.

Sound like your dealer is trying to make it right, then.

You make an excellent observation about the cats. I knew that too but I never thought to put a different cat on there. I think you're correct that your high flow and smaller cats are preventing the issue with the control arms.

I actually think my first engine tic was from the stretchy belt. When Ford was troubleshooting it that first time and removed the belt, they may have found a different noise after the belt was removed. So I think they actually rebuilt the motor for a different noise. It is my strong assumption that the act of removing the original belt and putting it back on solved the actual tic. Then, when it got warmed up outside, the belt finally got back to a condition where it would make the noise. Hence, my decision to remove the belt and run the TSB. So what I'm assuming at this point is one could simply replace the noisy stretchy belt with a new stretchy belt and the noise would be solved for a short time or possibly indefinitely.

From what I have read, the noise from the stretchy belt is caused by the belt being too tight and causing a load on the crank which causes a knock. The TSB eliminates the stretchy belt and replaces it with a belt and tensioner which probably causes less of a load. A new stretchy belt may eliminate the problem if it is slightly larger and not causing as much of an eccentric load.

Hey Everyone,

Just purchased a 2016 GT auto today. Had 5.4 miles on it when I bought it. Drove it off the lot, all was fine for about 100 miles till we stopped for a bio break. Got back in the car, felt a funny up shift from 1st to 2nd. Slowed down for 2-1 downshift and that felt funny as well. Got back on the highway and felt a bit of a vibration, very similar to what my 2014 drive shaft issue felt like. My dad felt the issue as well and in fact, he's the one that brought it up. I wasn't going to say anything and was going to t/s it on my own.

So I drove it around and for some reason put my hand on the emergency break and felt a tumbling/rumbling/knocking sensation. I know the center support for the drive shaft is near there.

I'm going to put it on a lift tomorrow and check it out. Suspecting the rubber is not right, or the bolts came loose. We'll see. I'll get back.

I'd drive it back to the dealer. It's a brand new car - make them fix it.

they're 160 miles away. I'm just going to inspect it myself and get what I need on video. After that lemon I just turned in, they can come pick it up if they want to fix it.

I got it on a lift and the drive shaft rubber is very soft. I'm like 99% it's the cause. I was in a hurry so didn't take a video but I plan to take the video for you all if/when I install a 1 pc drive shaft.

Just reported my concern to the dealer. The sales person advised that he's going to push this up the ladder.

Guys, maybe I shouldn't buy a Mustang at this point? Is it too much to expect that I shouldn't have to fix new cars all the time? :doh::fear::spank::innocent::dunno:

As I use the car more, I learn a little more.

When the car is cold, the drive shaft doesn't hit the top of the center support ( the feeling in the emergency break handle ) as bad, but you still get the feeling of a bumpy road in the car. ( yes the drive shaft issue feels almost exactly like a tire with a flat spot or a bumpy road ). However, when that rubber warms up, that's when I feel the hitting sensation in the emergency break handle.

Last week, I felt a similar sensations in the 2016 GT I rented for a day ( minus the feeling in the break handle ).

couple of points:

1. Since the issue feels like a bad tire or bumpy road, the average person isn't reporting any issue to Ford.
2. This is very likely a systemic issue with the center support itself, affecting many more customers than just myself.
3. Not sure if Ford will work with me to investigate the issue as systemic
4. My specific car may be potentially unsafe to drive back to the dealer. At the very least, very uncomfortable to drive back to the dealer.
5. Given the above, a 1 pc DS is looking like a pretty good option but ouch, I just plopped 3500 down payment

Wow, sounds like your last car was a nightmare. I'm surprised you went with a Mustang again. I don't notice any weird vibrations with my 14 GT but I do have some noise that I can't pinpoint. I don't know if it's the rear end or the tires. I've had it in to Ford a couple of times for it but they always say it's the tires. Maybe once I get rid of the Pirelli's, I will know more. good luck on getting this new car fixed.

Wayne

I have the tick also and it has gotten worse. Tried oil changes and different octanes. Sadly, with just 19k miles I am out of warranty. (2012)

I love the car more than any car I've ever owned but already replacing all 4 flaked off wheels, hood corrosion that now appears to have returned, and now the engine tick...all the stories about crappy LCR, AC and water pumps going out right at warranty end...

I've seriously been contemplating the SRT8 Challenger. More to come.

Thanks for your post. I've since returned the 2016 Mustang to the dealer for a refund. The dealer, Ford managers and myself all agreed it would be best to end our relationship at this point.

I figured the 2016 would be better and in a lot of ways, it is much better. I know the center support for the shaft was changed with I hope, the intention of making it better. But in my opinion, it's much worse than the old carrier. How does that happen? Mind blowing...

Issues with the returned Mustang:

1. Drive shaft vibration
2. A/C clutch engagements very loud
3. drivers side wind noise ( no noise on the passenger side ).

thought: they can't fix the drive shaft in any reasonable amount of time as it's my opinion that the issue is systemic. I had the same issue with a 2016 GT Rental. I feel if they replaced it I would have the same issue 100 miles later. They might be calling me to go over my points, not sure.

Regarding your noise. Some dealerships will minimize and deflect any warranty work. Which is what I believe they're doing in your case. Or, they would have told you this: When you hear the noise, throw the car out of gear. If it goes away, it's likely rear diff. If it doesn't go away, it's more likely to be tires. They can't know 100% for sure if it's tires or not, without troubleshooting. They're stalling you, even though they may not know it themselves. Their system just tells them to.

Would be happy to hear back from you here on your results.

Thanks for the post.

For the engine tick, remove the a/c belt and see if the noise goes away or stays.

I'm looking at the 2016 Camaro 1SS pretty hard at the moment. That Lt1 omg what a motor... Hope the quality is better. Considering the manual trans as the auto has cylinder deactivation....yuk. Are the designers insane?

You do know that the 2015s were held back because the driveshaft was hitting by like 1mm, right? Watch that Netflix documentary on the development of the 2015 - towards the end, they say they have it fixed. Maybe it wasn't fixed afterall...

Thanks for your post here.

No I didn't know that but it's my very strong assumption they didn't fix it. I could be wrong. All they need to do is make the rubber more dense. Very easy to fix...Why can't they get it right? The concept is very old and very simple. Absolutely amazing.

Just watched the documentary. Good stuff. Thank you so much for mentioning that to us here on the community. I'm showing it to the managers at the dealer as well. Maybe they should make a TSB at this point....:doh:

I just now found this holy be jebus : http://www.mustang6g.com/forums/showthread.php?t=15990

I was shocked they mentioned it in the video, since a lot of people waited on their 2015 orders with no word as to why they were delayed. Especially considering how many people complain about vibrations on these cars.

You should hear my car now, after I removed the Dynamat'ed heat shield from my MGW. I plan on buying a carbon fiber driveshaft to help with some of the noises (supposedly the CF shafts absorb a lot of noise). My car literally sounds like a race car with straight cut gears. Clanks, booms, bumps, whines...I've honestly started to just ignore them and accept they're just a part of Mustang ownership. Besides, they only bother me at low speeds when I'm trying to drive smooth/quiet and conserve fuel (which, is most of the time). But when I drive the car hard, they all combine to provide a very mechanical, raw symphony.

So, it kinda is what it is for me...

Ticking
 

Ill add my car to the list of frequent tickers talked about on this forum. Ive been dealing with it off and on for almost a year now....

Last summer several visits yielded cam cap bolts replaced. (After i had to remind ford about one time use TTY engine hardware 😐)
A pcv (i think..) valve replaced

The noise seamed to go away over the mild winter here in yuma untill about 2 weeks ago when i heard it again. This time the water pump was replaced.
As of today the service manager listed to my car again and believes it to be piston slap. The car goes in monday.

Anyone on here have issues with piston slap?? Mine does it at operating temp after i have been driving for awhile. So its not just a startup issue.