GT500 dual fuel pump seals?
 

I upgraded the fuel pump on my boosted '10 GT to the FRPP dual pump a few years and 40k miles ago.

Recently one of the pump discharge seals between the pump outlet and manifold failed, causing total loss of fuel pressure.

Has anyone seen this before? I think this could be repaired 100% just by replacing this seal, but I don't have a source for them. Does anyone know of a source, or have an old pump I could cannibalize?
https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/themust...95475f13e9.jpg
blown out pump discharge seal
https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/themust...6f81139da8.jpg
Blown out pump discharge seal, installed (right)

Welcome to TMS.
Had you tried a Ford dealership ??
.
.

I've had email conversations with an online Ford parts store, and the FRPP warranty people. They consider it "part of an assembly" and couldn't provide a part number or source for the seals.

No, Ford Does Not Service Parts on the Fuel Pumps it's Sold as an assembly. I don't remember who made those Pumps but if there is a Name on the Pump Like Bosch Etc. I think they are Actually Delphi. You May attack from That Angle. Sometimes Ford Seals will have an Embossed Number on Them that may help the Search as Well!. Also Look for Any Numbers on the Sub Assembly Where the Seal Mounts that may help as well!

I found These Guys Seems Like They Might Have Some Answers for you!

https://www.fuelpumpfactory.com/prod...0ea42a67faa5a0


https://www.fuelpumpfactory.com/pages/about-us

If Push Comes to Shove Here is a Cheaper Pump than Motorcraft.

https://www.rockauto.com/en/catalog/...assembly,10147

K

Thanks.

Replacement pumps won't help me because they still need intact seals between their discharge port and the "manifold" that delivers fuel to the hat, and it seems all the pump replacement kits don't include those.

I contacted Ford Performance, and they weren't able to provide a part number or source for the seals. Seems a shame to have to ditch the entire ~$400 pump assembly over a seal that goes for maybe $2.

All the GT500 pumps--Motorcraft, Delphi, Carter, other aftermarket--are in short supply now, and brand names are $$$$. I did find a cheap "Chinese knockoff" on Amazon for $60, so that's what I'm using now. The reason the original failed is that it's a crappy design, which all share, so if I have to buy another crappy design, might as well be cheap, right? I can afford to swap out 6 or more of these for the price of one of the others.

As far as I can tell without disassembling it, construction and materials of the cheap replacement are identical to the old one, except perhaps the pumps and seals. Since it shares the same bad design for screws retaining the discharge manifold, I added some extra "insurance"--a zip tie holding down the manifold to the frame as "secondary retention" to prevent the screws from being pounded out and manifold from releasing from the pumps.

The car feels much better now--much better throttle response. I had noticed weaker throttle response for a while before this failed completely, but didn't get around to datalogging or investigating. In hindsight, I think if I had done that, I'd have seen low fuel pressure and found this before the seal was destroyed.

So I'd advise anyone running a GT500 fuel pump on an S197 to check fuel pressure, especially if you've noticed laggy throttle response. If it's low, check the pump for loose manifold screws, and repair as needed.

Thank You For Coming Back & Giving us the Rest of the Story. So Often People Come in Get some Info and Never Come Back.. That does not help the Next guy and That is part Circle of Knowledge.

I'm Sorry I could Not Help More. Back In the Day I had Some Great Contacts at Roush & Even a Ford Engineer or two at the R&D Center But That was So Long Ago. Sounds Like you got a Handle on it. Somebody makes the Subcomponents Somewhere! Btw Roush Does a Lot of Stuff for Ford Racing. Might not Hurt to Call Their Tech Line & See if They Know anything.

Best of Luck!

KC

another pump seal failure report (2014)
 

I stumbled across an old forum post that documents exactly the same problem I'm seeing. Maybe this will help others understand the issue.

The fundamental problem is a poor design of the fuel manifold that the pumps discharge into. Fuel pressure tends to push the manifold up, away from the pumps, and the force fluctuates as the pumps cycle up and down, throttle is open/closed, engine is shut off, etc. The only parts resisting this fluctuating load and keeping the manifold attached are two small screws between the manifold and plastic pump frame.

These screws are loaded axially and threaded into soft plastic with no anti-rotation features, and no other secondary retention feature. So what happens is that the cycling pressure loads drive the manifold up and down, causing it to act as a hammer driving the screws out. When one of the screws finally falls out, the manifold raises enough to cause a high speed fuel leak around a pump grommet, ultimately tearing it and causing a complete loss of fuel pressure. This all invisible to the driver/owner--the leaks and damage are all happening inside the fuel tank.

Another GT500 fuel pump failure (reported 2014)

:nice:

Rocking Man! Thanks for that Extra Effort!:salute:


KC