Originally Posted by rhumb
(Post 1010745)
Seems like Ford itself has acknowledged and bowed to the utter, and well deserved, loathings of the Focus restyle.
http://www.autoblog.com/2007/09/24/f...umer-backlash/ While this is little more than putting some cheap lipstick on a pig, it does show at least some dull glimmer of sensitivity to consumer wants and reactions. You can guild a pile of sh*t with gold, but at the end of the day, it will still smell like a pile of sh*t. Of course, I would never refer to the "new" Focus as a pile of sh*t. :jester: |
Seems the pile of sh*t received a pretty decent review, albeit one. Favorable even, some may read . .
http://www.thecarconnection.com/Vehi...3393.html?pg=1 |
I recently took a trip from chicago to lower michigan in my 2007 focus.
Did a few tricks for mileage and kept speed around 60-65 and i managed 42mpg. that'll do focus...that'll do. |
Originally Posted by Knight
(Post 1011471)
... and i managed 42mpg.
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Originally Posted by Evil_Capri
(Post 1011466)
Seems the pile of sh*t received a pretty decent review, albeit one. Favorable even, some may read . .
http://www.thecarconnection.com/Vehi...3393.html?pg=1 |
Originally Posted by Hollywood_North GT
(Post 1009123)
Yeah, let's make our car just as plain and fugly as everyone else's. That'll lure buyers away from entrenched stalwarts like Corolla and Civic.
Way to stand out from the competition. Good strategy. :nice: lower price, more hp and torque than Civic and Corolla, Sync system, bigger trunk,new look, that's the strategy. http://info.detnews.com/autosconsume...x.cfm?id=26922 A positive review of the 08 Focus. |
Originally Posted by Vermillion06
(Post 1012921)
http://info.detnews.com/pix/autos/re...focuschart.jpg
lower price, more hp and torque than Civic and Corolla, Sync system, bigger trunk,new look, that's the strategy. http://info.detnews.com/autosconsume...x.cfm?id=26922 A positive review of the 08 Focus. In any case, this last-millenium chassis flypapered with every badly rendered stylistic cliche in the book is clearly a time and money biding move while Ford tried to desperately staunch its corporate blood loss and get a truly world class small car here to their U.S. showrooms. Should have been the current Euro Focus already, but Ford U.S., in its managerial and strategic ineptnetude, botched that all up. |
Originally Posted by Vermillion06
(Post 1012921)
http://info.detnews.com/pix/autos/re...focuschart.jpg
lower price, more hp and torque than Civic and Corolla, Sync system, bigger trunk,new look, that's the strategy. http://info.detnews.com/autosconsume...x.cfm?id=26922 A positive review of the 08 Focus. |
Originally Posted by rhumb
(Post 1012931)
Trouble is, you still have to look at the thing ... my eyes, MY EYES ... perhaps a better car for blind drivers and artic winters.
Now, I don't think it's the world's most beautiful design, but compared to the other cars in it's class in the US it doesn't look out of place, and looks a bit more aggressive than Corolla & Civic. Sort of like when Mr. Potatohead puts on his "angry eyes". Which cars in the Focus' class in the US are bought solely for their sexy styling anyway?
Originally Posted by rhumb
(Post 1012931)
In any case, this last-millenium chassis
Originally Posted by rhumb
(Post 1012931)
Should have been the current Euro Focus already,
. |
Originally Posted by rhumb
(Post 1012931)
Trouble is, you still have to look at the thing ... my eyes, MY EYES ... perhaps a better car for blind drivers and artic winters.
When you are driving it you never have to look at it. so maybe its better to buy one then not. |
Originally Posted by Vermillion06
(Post 1012984)
In your opinion, which is clouded by the bitterness that it's not the C1 Focus.
But it'll sure hurt Ford.
Originally Posted by Vermillion06
(Post 1012984)
Now, I don't think it's the world's most beautiful design, but compared to the other cars in it's class in the US it doesn't look out of place, and looks a bit more aggressive than Corolla & Civic. Sort of like when Mr. Potatohead puts on his "angry eyes".
Originally Posted by Vermillion06
(Post 1012984)
Which cars in the Focus' class in the US are bought solely for their sexy styling anyway?
I hate to break it to you, Mr. "I always drink the Ford Kool-Aid", but that also-ran strategy won't cut it anymore. The Focus' specs are smack dab in the middle of the Vanilla pile, and do nothing to make the Focus stand out as a car that people would choose over Civic and Corolla, who are the entrenched leaders with a staunchly supportive buying public. "Look, our car is pretty much as good in several key respects, and even has a few features they don't!" Ummmm, sorry, not good enough in this day & age. Despite improved quality, consumers still aren't giving domestics a chance on many of their vehicles >> Those negative impressions are now souring efforts by Ford Motor Co., General Motors Corp. and Chrysler LLC to halt their long slide in U.S. market share. And for these Detroit auto makers, persuading import buyers to even consider a U.S. car is becoming the new battleground. I know you think Ford can do no wrong, but cars like the "new" Focus don't help matters.
Originally Posted by Vermillion06
(Post 1012984)
How old is the 2008 Corolla chassis? The 9th gen Corolla debuted in Asia in 2000 (2003 in the US) and was based on a chassis from 1997. It's been pretty much unchanged since it's debut.
Originally Posted by Vermillion06
(Post 1012984)
:doh:Arghhh! Coulda ,Shoulda, Woulda... Get a Mazda 3 or that C1 based Volvo if its really that important to have a C1 based car. Or move to Europe.:grin: Or, in about two years, the C2 will be here.
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Originally Posted by Hollywood_North GT
(Post 1013124)
It's not about bitterness. It's about Ford getting its sh*t together.
Ford is, as you so crudely put it, is working on "getting its sh*t toghether" and the 08 Focus is an evolutionary step toward the C2.
Originally Posted by Hollywood_North GT
(Post 1013124)
If Ford goes under, it won't hurt him, or me...or most of the buying public.
Originally Posted by Hollywood_North GT
(Post 1013124)
But it'll sure hurt Ford.
Originally Posted by Hollywood_North GT
(Post 1013124)
Did you just say the new Focus looks like Mr. Potatohead? Are you trying to convince us here or what?
Originally Posted by Hollywood_North GT
(Post 1013124)
That's like saying, "Everyone else is turning out a humdrum product, so it must be OK if we turn out a humdrum product, too."
Originally Posted by Hollywood_North GT
(Post 1013124)
I hate to break it to you, Mr. "I always drink the Ford Kool-Aid", but that also-ran strategy won't cut it anymore. The Focus' specs are smack dab in the middle of the Vanilla pile, and do nothing to make the Focus stand out as a car that people would choose over Civic and Corolla, who are the entrenched leaders with a staunchly supportive buying public.
Originally Posted by Hollywood_North GT
(Post 1013124)
"Look, our car is pretty much as good in several key respects, and even has a few features they don't!" Ummmm, sorry, not good enough in this day & age.
Originally Posted by Hollywood_North GT
(Post 1013124)
I know you think Ford can do no wrong, but cars like the "new" Focus don't help matters.
Ford invested a lot of money in this refresh, it's not just "let's slap a new front fascia on the same body and call it good." They made a lot of improvements in NVH, weight savings ,an 80% new body, a new bodystyle (the coupe), and added some nice features such as Sync. So what should Ford have done? Just thrown all that investment away and abandon the compact car market until the C2 arrives because some dorks on the internet want Euro Fords and nothing else will do for them?
Originally Posted by Hollywood_North GT
(Post 1013124)
The difference is it's working for them, isn't it? You've got to stop comparing the import strategy with Ford, because their recent history is MUCH different.
If the authors of every road test of the '08 Focus didn't feel the need to point out that it's not an all-new chassis, people wouldn't know or care. No one points out how "long in the tooth" the Corolla is. The updated C170 chassis should work better than just "okay", considering it was already considered one of the best already. |
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Originally Posted by Vermillion06
(Post 1013885)
Yes it is. The 2008 Focus is not judged on it's own merits by the "enthusiasts" on the interweb, every criticsm of the car alway has "waahh, this sucks! the C1 should be here in the US" somewhere in it. The C1 Focus is not coming to the US, end of story. Whining about it now is not going to change that, but the C2 will be here.
Originally Posted by Vermillion06
(Post 1013885)
Ford is, as you so crudely put it, is working on "getting its sh*t toghether" and the 08 Focus is an evolutionary step toward the C2.
And the '08 Focus is in no way "an evolutionary step towards the C2." At least, I hope to god it isn't!
Originally Posted by Vermillion06
(Post 1013885)
I don't care about Toyota's well being and I don't spend any time griping about it on Toyota message boards.
Originally Posted by Vermillion06
(Post 1013885)
Gee Captain Obvious, thank you for that insight! I never would have thought of that myself!!!:rolleyes:
Originally Posted by Vermillion06
(Post 1013885)
Please learn what the term "facetious" means.
Originally Posted by Vermillion06
(Post 1013885)
Oh, so Ford should just put out products designed in a vacuum, not paying any attention to what any of the competition is like? They should have spent enough on materials and design to market the finest $30K base price compacts in the entry level field when everybody else is selling cars at half that?
Originally Posted by Vermillion06
(Post 1013885)
It matches or exceeds the two sales leaders on horsepower & beats both on torque. The Cobalt beats all of them on horsepower and torque, but that's not helping the Cobalt beat the Civic and Corolla in sales is it? There's more to the car than just the spec sheet.
Originally Posted by Vermillion06
(Post 1013885)
So what should they have done, seeing how Ford is cashed-strapped right now and the C2 not ready till '09/'10? I hear a lot griping from you but I haven't seen any concrete answers. And don't give that "they should bring over the C1 Focus" crap.
Originally Posted by Vermillion06
(Post 1013885)
People like you aren't helping.
Originally Posted by Vermillion06
(Post 1013885)
Ford invested a lot of money in this refresh, it's not just "let's slap a new front fascia on the same body and call it good." They made a lot of improvements in NVH, weight savings ,an 80% new body, a new bodystyle (the coupe), and added some nice features such as Sync. So what should Ford have done? Just thrown all that investment away and abandon the compact car market until the C2 arrives because some dorks on the internet want Euro Fords and nothing else will do for them?
Originally Posted by Vermillion06
(Post 1013885)
It proves most people don't know or care how old the chassis the car is built on is, as long as works okay and it has a good reputation.
Originally Posted by Vermillion06
(Post 1013885)
No one points out how "long in the tooth" the Corolla is.
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There's a lot of Mazda 3's running around here and a nice smattering of Volvo S40's too. Their popularity convinces me that the C1 chassis is a winner despite its' higher pricing, and Ford could've cashed in and built on that. Instead, Ford decides to "Aztecify" and "Caliberate" Ford buyers with the '08 Focus until the C2 arrives. Ford better do a darn good job with it because the new Corolla will show up around then, along w/a revamped Civic (given Japanese auto manufacturer's production cycles).
|
Another nice review . .
http://www.autoweek.com/apps/pbcs.dl.../71002005/1065 Our appreciation is enhanced by the NVH improvements. This Focus is one of the quietest, smoothest small cars we’ve driven in some time—certainly more so than competitors (by price) such as the Scion xD, the Dodge Caliber, the ’07 Toyota Corolla and the Honda Fit—and the improvement spills over into other aspects of its performance. The Duratec four has always been a peaky engine and weak at the bottom end. Yet noise and vibration reduction seems to quiet down the Duratec, smoothing its rougher edges when it’s spinning near the power peak at 6000 rpm, which is where you’ll need to keep it if you expect to have much fun. The shifter is more cooperative now, and, with manual trans, the powertrain can be an effective, satisfying tool. This Focus still has a multilink independent rear suspension, while many competitors have cut costs with a torsion-beam axle. There is essentially one suspension calibration (though the base S has no rear sway bar), and it’s middle-of-the-road. Even with the upgrade 16-inch Pirellis, there isn’t a lot of tire. All that said, the Focus is still better sorted—better balanced between maintaining ride quality and maximizing contact patch—than a lot of small cars, including Mazda’s standard 3. |
Originally Posted by hi5.0
(Post 1014098)
There's a lot of Mazda 3's running around here and a nice smattering of Volvo S40's too. Their popularity convinces me that the C1 chassis is a winner despite its' higher pricing, and Ford could've cashed in and built on that. Instead, Ford decides to "Aztecify" and "Caliberate" Ford buyers with the '08 Focus until the C2 arrives. Ford better do a darn good job with it because the new Corolla will show up around then, along w/a revamped Civic (given Japanese auto manufacturer's production cycles).
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Originally Posted by Evil_Capri
(Post 1017380)
But I stand by my assertion that the exterior design is a mess...and unlikely to win over any import-buyers. There is also this caveat in that article >> Forgive our lack of anticipation for Ford’s new Focus. The 2008 Focus is, after all, the once-beloved original warmed over a second time, nearly a decade after its introduction, while Europe enjoys a new-generation Focus closely related to the Mazda 3. The reader (aka potential buyer) comments beneath the article say it all. |
Originally Posted by Hollywood_North GT
(Post 1013966)
Let's hope Ford is still healthy enough by the time the C2 arrives to benefit from its arrival. More importantly, let's hope Ford of North America doesn't muck up the design of the Focus C2. The European kinetic design is just fine, thank you very much.
Originally Posted by Hollywood_North GT
(Post 1013966)
And the '08 Focus is in no way "an evolutionary step towards the C2." At least, I hope to god it isn't!
The US is the US;Europe is Europe. They are different markets. Just because some people want the US to be Europe doesn't make it so.
Originally Posted by Hollywood_North GT
(Post 1013966)
Well perhaps that's because you don't own a Toyota, nor do you have any vested interest in the company. On the other hand, I just bought a Ford, and would like to see the company thrive again. Patting management on the back and giving them a cookie when they turn out a turd like the new Focus doesn't help, nor is it concomitant with an effective near-term strategy to wipe clean a sea of red ink.
Originally Posted by Hollywood_North GT
(Post 1013966)
Stop making excuses for a blown strategy, shortsightedness and corporate waste! They should look at what works in the company (Ford is the #1 selling brand in the UK for a reason) and find ways to apply that strategy - and if necessary, products - here.
Originally Posted by Hollywood_North GT
(Post 1013966)
You're making my point for me. The specs alone won't sell the Focus.
Originally Posted by Hollywood_North GT
(Post 1013966)
What will sell it - or any new Ford, for that matter - is innovation of the kind we saw in the mid-'80s with the Taurus. That car took the automotive world by storm by offering bold new design, well packaged features, and competitive performance. The Focus offers nothing that will catch the consumers' eyes, nor which is compelling enough to lure them away from the entrenched segment leaders.
Originally Posted by Hollywood_North GT
(Post 1013966)
What they should have done was not to have put themselves in this mess to begin with. But at least if they were going to redesign this current Focus, they could have come up with something less unattractive. Good design doesn't cost any more than bad design.
Originally Posted by Hollywood_North GT
(Post 1013966)
No one has to...it's (the Corolla) selling by the bushel-full.
"The 2008 Corolla rides on an ancient, outdated chassis (utilizing a bean-counter's choice twist beam rear suspension design) dating to 1997, 11 LONG years ago; the car has not been upgraded and has stayed completely unchanged since it's US debut in 2002, 5 LONG years ago." |
Originally Posted by Hollywood_North GT
(Post 1017633)
The reader (aka potential buyer) comments beneath the article say it all.
Where's the Corolla and Civic hatch and wagon? Hmm? |
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