Bert

I know there is discussion of this sprinkled about in many other threads, but it is hard to find them and pull together a coherent story, so I thought I'd start a new thread. Plus new threads are fun.

My mustang is my daily driver (don't actually drive it every day, but very often) and I also use it for track days and nights on my local tracks (Thompson Speedway Road Course and Palmer Motorsports Park, so far) . . . If I went to all of them, it would be two or three events per month during the summer (it's a great time to be a road track addict!).

I rarely have any substantial time to prep the car before a track event, so I'd like to avoid two sets of pads if at all possible. Even if I bought two sets, reality tells me one of them is going to stay in the car for a long time.

I have the 14" 4-piston Brembos on the front, and stock rotors/calipers on the back. I think I will upsize the rear rotors in the near future.

My tires are Bridgestone Potenza S-04 Pole Position which really aren't very good track tires. They turn to greasy mush when they get hot. Someday maybe I will get some better tires, but in the mean time I don't want to over-brake them.

I have been running StopTech Street Performance pads, which seem OK to me. I haven't noticed any major brake fade on the track; but maybe I just need to learn how to brake, LOL. I like them because they are OK on the street, no noise though they are quite dusty. Also fairly inexpensive.

I talked to Carbotech and they recommended XP10 for the front and XP8 for the back, but warned they can be quite noisy. Also noticed that Hawk is now selling "Street Race Pads" but they warn they are noisy also. Both of these say they will perform fine on the street (when cold) but noise could be an issue. I might be OK with the noise myself, but don't want to scare all the other cars on the road.

So my questions are --

1) you guys who drive your cars on the street and the track; what are you using for pads? How are they working for you?

2) have any of you used the XP10/8 on the street, and how noisy are they?

Or any other thoughts / suggestions?

thanks in advance!

5.M0NSTER

On the pads topic, I use XP10/8 combo on the track. Works fantastic. Good, deep braking and very easy modulation. Only one out of the last 9 events did I get fade, and it was my fault. Braking too early. These pads like going deep into the brake zone, initiating a 20% apply for 0.5s or so to let the weight transfer, and going full ABS abs apply after.

I keep the XP8s on the back permanently. They dust a lot, but the noise is not too bad. I can live with it. The noise from the XP10s on the street is unbearable for me though.

So I swap the XP10s on and off. I'll keep them on if I have a week or 2 between events, and just brake late on the street to minimize the noise.

I have been looking for 1 pad for street and track, but no luck yet. I know the GT350s have a pad that works on both street and track, but the lining disappears quickly. But for the 4 piston system I don't know of any pads which can truly do both duties with little noise.

Also I my experience with the S04s has been VERY different than yours. The only time mine get greasy if they are over pressure. Mine like being at ~36PSI HOT. Over 40PSI hot they start sliding around more. That means 29-30 PSI before I start my sessions. Here is a few laps at Mid-O with these tires at operating temp. As you can see greasiness is not an issue for me, and they have ~30% thread left in this vid.

Bert

Thanks, that is exactly the info that I have been looking for. I guess changing the fronts is a good compromise. If I had garage and a floor jack, that would be a lot quicker. I guess it is time to buy a floor jack, I can tote it out to the driveway when needed.

Nice looking laps . . . it is hard to judge how hard you are pushing the tires, but judging by the sound you are similar to me.

Here is a lousy (out of focus) picture of my front tire after it has been good and hot. You can see the glossy looking surface but can't see the melted marbles all over. I am not sure if this is normal and expected?

I probably do need to look closer at my tire pressures, might be too high but based on the roll-over to the marks on the sidewall, it is about right. I have kinda lost track during the past couple tack nights because I have been pressed for time to get there (late) and then distracted by my advancetrack issue.

5.M0NSTER

Here is the roll over on mine, I think this may have something to do with the performance you're expecting. Mine get a lot of molten thread too, but thanks to this they really hook up well.

In the video above I was 9/10ths.

Bert

Update: I got the Carbotech XP8/10 pads installed. Ran them on one shortened Track Night (due to my advancetrack issue) and they worked well on the track, though I haven't really gotten the hang of them yet.

On the street, they are nice and quiet most of the time. But they do let out a screetch and/or groan that is pretty painful once in a while. This seems to be usually during very light braking, like in a parking lot. Peformance wise, they are no problem. They beg to be pressured a bit more, then they don't squeal but they do slow you down quicker than needed.

And wow, they weren't kidding when they said they were dusty! I thought my original Brembo pads, and the StopTech Street performance pads I replaced them with, were dusty . . . but these make those look clean by comparison.

I am not sure if I am going to be able to live with them on the street or not, need to give it a bit more time.

5.M0NSTER

Hey Bert! Glad you like the pads. They do in fact work great on the track.

If I can share one lesson I learned, it's that these pads like to be warm, but not HOT. What I mean by that is they like braking late, and they hate riding the brake pedal half way.

What I discovered is that when I brake early, and keep my foot on the pedal for one or two markers longer than I really need to (aka start braking by 5, bled speed by 3 and keep my foot on the brake till 1, they transfer material, and start vibrating my steering wheel. Also the only time I got brake fade was doing this.

But if I do this right, and don't bake until I see GOD (aka don't brake till 3 marker, and be pedal as hard as I can by the 2 marker) they bled speed like crazy and they stay composed lap after lap after lap.

Just my $0.02 from 3 years of CT brakes.

Bert

Thanks for that, I think I know what you are talking about and have already experienced it, and it was bothering me a little.

At Thompson speedway road course (my local track) the main straight is ~120 MPH and then turn 1 is a fairly hard right . . . since I was not confident in the pads yet, plus I have my stupid advance track thing going on, I was braking fairly early and long there and getting that vibration and also a brake noise that I didn't like (sort of a moaning noise, not the squeal that I was expecting). I can probably brake MUCH later and harder there, just need to build the confidence to do it.

5.M0NSTER

I think I know the groan you're talking about (like a low woo wooo wooo wooo wooo type sound). I have gotten it a few times. I think that happens when there is a lot of deposits on the rotors.

Bert

LOL, yeah that's close, maybe more of a "roour-roour-roour-roour" . . . . and yes there were a lot of deposits on the rotors and fairly uneven / blotchy

Bert

Update: I just ordered Carbotech street pads for the front. I cannot live with the noise of the XP10's on the street. My daughter won't ride with me any more, and I'm tired of explaning to everyone at the gas station that they are track pads, and it's normal for them to be noisy, I don't need a brake job.

In the mean time, I really need one of those stickers, LOL!

(brakes squeal because race car)

5.M0NSTER

You and me both! XP10s are too loud for me as well for daily driving. How do you find the XP8s in the back?

Here is mine. Got it at http://www.trackdecals.com/products/...-racecar-decal

Bert

I can't tell yet but I hope most of the noise is coming from the front, and hopefully I won't have to go back and order the street rears too. These Carbotech pads ain't cheap! According to Carbotech a lot of guys run the street pads on the front and the XP8's on the rear and they are not too bad on the street.

5.M0NSTER

yup. That's what I do too. I'm ok with the noise

redonblackpony

I have had very good luck with the carbotech 10/8 combo. I do have front brake duct cooling which helps keep the pads at the proper temps.
I cannot say enough good things about these pads. I still have plenty of thickness left and I have used these pads for numerous track days.
I talked with Matt at carbotech and he agreed that the pad life is increased when brake temperatures are kept lower.
I will be trying the new 12\10 combo as I now have sticker tires. This combo should still be rotor friendly. All pads shipped to my door for less than $400!

5.M0NSTER

Awesome, I'll be looking forward to your review of the 12/10 combo.

I will be getting stickier rubber next season too, and I think I need to go 12/10 as well. This season I've used 1/2 of my XP10s with just 3 events. No brake cooling though.

I'm planing on running RE71Rs next season. Hopefully my XP10s last for 2-3 events.