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Burton ! The 24ft lb specs are for 2005- early 2008 4.6 3v models that had the old high threaded 16mm 2 piece design spark plugs.. I know this through personal experience, as I changed my plugs last year on my 2006 GT..
Rocky... that sounds more right. I remember using my inch-lb torque wrench now that I think about it.
On the comment about using a magnet/tool to pick up the debris - isn't that useless because the pieces in there are broken porcelain from the spark plug? lol
Don't do all that work. Buy a foot or so of small rubber hose. Duct tape it to your shop vac hose. It will suck it up or (and) pull out the pieces of porcelain. If this makes any sense
Don't do all that work. Buy a foot or so of small rubber hose. Duct tape it to your shop vac hose. It will suck it up or (and) pull out the pieces of porcelain. If this makes any sense
That's my next step tonight Went to lowes on my lunch and got 2 different sizes of small clear tubing (very flexbile) in plumbing, only cost $1.66 for both pieces
Rocky... that sounds more right. I remember using my inch-lb torque wrench now that I think about it.
On the comment about using a magnet/tool to pick up the debris - isn't that useless because the pieces in there are broken porcelain from the spark plug? lol
You're absolutely 110% spot on regarding that comment Burton lol. I got so caught up in the moment trying to help out our fellow Mustanger that I wasn't thinking accurately before posting the magnet tool recommendation..
In the meantime, I thank you for correcting my mistake and realizing that using a magnet tool is totally useless for picking up porcelain debris..
Hopefully he'll be able to get those pieces out by attaching a vacuum line hose to a vacuum tube nozzle
Alright guys I know you all have been patiently waiting!! The car is officially done!! I would like to thank each and every one of you for all your help with this whole ordeal. I figured I would post up some pics and some techniques I used from my stash and also from users on this forum. Hopefully this will help someone in the future! This post will be pic heavy.
First, let’s revert back to show you how this all started. I followed the specs in my manual for putting spark plugs in (torque specs, which stated 25ft lbs of torque). Low and behold, I didn’t know the specs changed so I had a oopsie (The spec is should be is around 10ft lbs torque). Didn’t know about the oopsie until I started it and the idle was horrible. Tried to take it for a drive and I couldn’t get past 2k rpm without the engine bucking and almost throwing me in my seat.
Got back home, plugged the car in and found a cylinder 2 misfire. I took the coil off cylinder 2 and at first didn’t see anything wrong. On a closer inspection, I saw a little crack in the porcelain. So I went O s***, and proceeded to take off the coils of the other 7 plugs and they all had a nice long crack in them.
Took the 7 plugs out, luckily not to break any of them…until the 8th one on cylinder 2….. Went to pull the 8th one out, and half of the porcelain shattered in the spark plug hole. So in my optimistic eyes, I vacuumed it out, and said ok all set……so went to pull the spark plug actually out of the hole, and 3 more pieces shattered off of it while coming out, and went straight down into the cylinder…..
So for Sh*ts and giggle, I had most of this….
Go in there…..
At that point in time, I was scared S**tless, and came on this forum to ask for help. Luckily, many people stepped up to the plate and I personally thank you. Instead of saying every method I tried that failed, I’ll just give you the method and set up I used that worked great and hopefully someone can use this technique if they drop anything in the cylinder.
First, I found inside a item called a lint lizard. It is a extension for a vacuum cleaner to reach hard to reach places. I decided to try this and duck tape it to my shopvac. It is shown in green here.
As you see, after unsuccessfully sucking out the pieces from the cylinder with just that big clear tube (Thought it would have enough suction), I went to home depot and picked up a shop vac micro cleaning kit. It came with about 6-7 attachments to go from your shopvac hose to a miniature hose. The brand Home Depot sells is rigid and I have a craftsman, so needless to say, more duck tape. The reducer wouldn’t fit even close on the shop vac end so duck taped it to the end of the big clear tube from the lint lizard. It is the black piece that is at the end of the tube, looks, like a black cone. Needless to say, I probably couldn’t of just duck taped the reducer straight to the shop vac.....
Tried sucking it out that way, to anyone’s surprise, it still didn’t have the suction power the suck it out the hole. At this point in time, multiple people here suggested that I try getting a small flexible tube and actually stick it down spark plug hole, and that should suck out the pieces.
That is the clear mini hose you see at the end of the black cone, please don’t ask why I used medical tape here, I’m still wondering about it, lol.
I turned on my shop vac, put my finger on the end of the hose, and felt great suction, so I gave it a shot. Low and behold, it sucked the pieces out!!
The hose wasn’t big enough, so the pieces got stuck at the tip, so I ended up cutting the tip of the clear hose every time I sucked a piece out.
After proceeding the suck out all of the pieces from the cylinder, I installed the new plugs. By everyone’s advice here, and my own “feel” I ended up going with 12ft lbs torque. 10ft lbs on my torque wrench clicked after the plug just being hand tightened in (Didn’t feel comfortable with that), So I went up 2 more lbs with the wrench and it worked perfectly to make tighter.
The reason I went with motor craft instead of ngk again is because auto zone had a great deal on the 8 set, and also a 20% off online coupon and was available today. No complaints though.
So after that just for an added bonus since everything was apart, I decided it was a good time to do a few things.
First I took out my MAF sensor and cleaning it with MAF spray. Hard to tell if it was dirty or not, but since the battery was unplugged figured why not.
After that, since the battery was still unhooked like before, I went ahead and replaced my battery heat shield that was deteriorating with a new one I purchased.
After that I’m sitting there thinking. Since I took the CAI off (Which I just installed the weekend before), I decided the clean the throttle body while again….the battery is unhooked so I have to relearn the idle anyways…. Good thing I did there was so much gunk built up in there.
After all that, I put the car back together, and the thing runs, sounds, idles like a CHAMP!!
This is the first time I drove the car since installing the borla s catback and the CAI and these thing sounds like an absolute MONSTER now. I was standing on my garage stairs and the exhaust was vibrating my whole stair way it’s so deep, love it!!
Sorry back to the original post!! Lol. I hope this information helps even one person out there who gets the porcelain from a spark plug dropped into the cylinder. Thank you all for all your help, I couldn’t have done any of this without you. Brand new at this car maintenance stuff and must say getting pretty good at it.
Heres a small vid of the car running after doing the idle relearn..
I couldn't figure out how to change the title of the thread to cylinder 2 misfire, broken spark plug in cylinder removal and tips...If someone could edit it for me I would appreciate it
You definitely survived what could have been a terrible ordeal. Way to persevere and figure out a way out of it.
Thank you!! I was pretty proud myself, first sports car, first mustang, even first v8. And not knowing much about mechanical stuff I have been learning as I go, I'm one of those, "hey it looked easy on youtube" guys. Where it takes them 30 minutes, but then it take me 2 hours. I dont think I'll ever get to that level but still having fun doing it
Other than changing oil, some batteries, and 1 radiator, I hadn't wrenched anything until I got my first Mustang back in 2007. Started with axle backs and CAI. I've done so many things since then on multiple cars now.
Glad to hear it all worked out for you!
And way to go not giving up on it!
I'm just very confused on how an extra 12 ft lbs of tq broke the porcelain.
I personally think it was the socket that you originally used caused the porcelain to break!
I have probably changed an honest 800+ spark plugs in my life and have worked in many auto shops and have never heard of breaking the porcelain on a plug by over tightening, but I have broken porcelain tips by having the wrong socket or pinching the plug from a bad angel.
I just had to comment because I'm confused, I'm not trying to start an argument,
I'm just confused on this idea of an extra 12 ft lbs breaking all the plugs!
Glad to hear it all worked out for you!
And way to go not giving up on it!
I'm just very confused on how an extra 12 ft lbs of tq broke the porcelain.
I personally think it was the socket that you originally used caused the porcelain to break!
I have probably changed an honest 800+ spark plugs in my life and have worked in many auto shops and have never heard of breaking the porcelain on a plug by over tightening, but I have broken porcelain tips by having the wrong socket or pinching the plug from a bad angel.
I just had to comment because I'm confused, I'm not trying to start an argument,
I'm just confused on this idea of an extra 12 ft lbs breaking all the plugs!
No worries. I did mention in an earlier post that I didn't use a spark plug socket like I normally do my kit didn't have the right size so used a regular socket. I have also changed lots of plugs in mine and friends car and never had one break. First for everything! Just wish it didn't break as much as it did
Alright guys I know you all have been patiently waiting!! The car is officially done!! I would like to thank each and every one of you for all your help with this whole ordeal. I figured I would post up some pics and some techniques I used from my stash and also from users on this forum. Hopefully this will help someone in the future! This post will be pic heavy.
First, let’s revert back to show you how this all started. I followed the specs in my manual for putting spark plugs in (torque specs, which stated 25ft lbs of torque). Low and behold, I didn’t know the specs changed so I had a oopsie (The spec is should be is around 10ft lbs torque). Didn’t know about the oopsie until I started it and the idle was horrible. Tried to take it for a drive and I couldn’t get past 2k rpm without the engine bucking and almost throwing me in my seat.
Got back home, plugged the car in and found a cylinder 2 misfire. I took the coil off cylinder 2 and at first didn’t see anything wrong. On a closer inspection, I saw a little crack in the porcelain. So I went O s***, and proceeded to take off the coils of the other 7 plugs and they all had a nice long crack in them.
Took the 7 plugs out, luckily not to break any of them…until the 8th one on cylinder 2….. Went to pull the 8th one out, and half of the porcelain shattered in the spark plug hole. So in my optimistic eyes, I vacuumed it out, and said ok all set……so went to pull the spark plug actually out of the hole, and 3 more pieces shattered off of it while coming out, and went straight down into the cylinder…..
So for Sh*ts and giggle, I had most of this….
Go in there…..
At that point in time, I was scared S**tless, and came on this forum to ask for help. Luckily, many people stepped up to the plate and I personally thank you. Instead of saying every method I tried that failed, I’ll just give you the method and set up I used that worked great and hopefully someone can use this technique if they drop anything in the cylinder.
First, I found inside a item called a lint lizard. It is a extension for a vacuum cleaner to reach hard to reach places. I decided to try this and duck tape it to my shopvac. It is shown in green here.
As you see, after unsuccessfully sucking out the pieces from the cylinder with just that big clear tube (Thought it would have enough suction), I went to home depot and picked up a shop vac micro cleaning kit. It came with about 6-7 attachments to go from your shopvac hose to a miniature hose. The brand Home Depot sells is rigid and I have a craftsman, so needless to say, more duck tape. The reducer wouldn’t fit even close on the shop vac end so duck taped it to the end of the big clear tube from the lint lizard. It is the black piece that is at the end of the tube, looks, like a black cone. Needless to say, I probably couldn’t of just duck taped the reducer straight to the shop vac.....
Tried sucking it out that way, to anyone’s surprise, it still didn’t have the suction power the suck it out the hole. At this point in time, multiple people here suggested that I try getting a small flexible tube and actually stick it down spark plug hole, and that should suck out the pieces.
That is the clear mini hose you see at the end of the black cone, please don’t ask why I used medical tape here, I’m still wondering about it, lol.
I turned on my shop vac, put my finger on the end of the hose, and felt great suction, so I gave it a shot. Low and behold, it sucked the pieces out!!
The hose wasn’t big enough, so the pieces got stuck at the tip, so I ended up cutting the tip of the clear hose every time I sucked a piece out.
After proceeding the suck out all of the pieces from the cylinder, I installed the new plugs. By everyone’s advice here, and my own “feel” I ended up going with 12ft lbs torque. 10ft lbs on my torque wrench clicked after the plug just being hand tightened in (Didn’t feel comfortable with that), So I went up 2 more lbs with the wrench and it worked perfectly to make tighter.
The reason I went with motor craft instead of ngk again is because auto zone had a great deal on the 8 set, and also a 20% off online coupon and was available today. No complaints though.
So after that just for an added bonus since everything was apart, I decided it was a good time to do a few things.
First I took out my MAF sensor and cleaning it with MAF spray. Hard to tell if it was dirty or not, but since the battery was unplugged figured why not.
After that, since the battery was still unhooked like before, I went ahead and replaced my battery heat shield that was deteriorating with a new one I purchased.
After that I’m sitting there thinking. Since I took the CAI off (Which I just installed the weekend before), I decided the clean the throttle body while again….the battery is unhooked so I have to relearn the idle anyways…. Good thing I did there was so much gunk built up in there.
After all that, I put the car back together, and the thing runs, sounds, idles like a CHAMP!!
This is the first time I drove the car since installing the borla s catback and the CAI and these thing sounds like an absolute MONSTER now. I was standing on my garage stairs and the exhaust was vibrating my whole stair way it’s so deep, love it!!
Sorry back to the original post!! Lol. I hope this information helps even one person out there who gets the porcelain from a spark plug dropped into the cylinder. Thank you all for all your help, I couldn’t have done any of this without you. Brand new at this car maintenance stuff and must say getting pretty good at it.
Heres a small vid of the car running after doing the idle relearn..
Let me just say that I'm so relieved you were finally able to get those porcelain pieces out of your cylinder head.. And I'm sure the rest of us who responded most definitely feel the same way as well..
Although it really sucks that you had to go through such a horrifying experience, it's also great to know that you can always rely on the help and support from your fellow Mustang enthusiasts here on TMS..
So don't ever hesitate to ask for help, as we're always here to provide support..
In the meantime, I would also like to thank you for taking the time for posting your pics during such a very difficult time in which they indeed are considered as very valuable for future reference for all of us..
Hopefully the mods will also consider turning this thread into a sticky, just as it should be as far as I'm concerned..
Anyway once again, I'm so glad that everything worked out and that your Mustang is back up and running like a champ once again..
-Rocky
Last edited by m05fastbackGT; 1/20/17 at 05:11 AM.
Let me just say that I'm so relieved you were finally able to get those porcelain pieces out of your cylinder head.. And I'm sure the rest of us who responded most definitely feel the same way as well..
Although it really sucks that you had to go through such a horrifying experience, it's also great to know that you can always rely on the help and support from your fellow Mustang enthusiasts here on TMS..
So don't ever hesitate to ask for help, as we're always here to provide support..
In the meantime, I would also like to thank you for taking the time for posting your pics during such a very difficult time in which they indeed are considered as very valuable for future reference for all of us..
Hopefully the mods will also consider turning this thread into a sticky, just as it should be as far as I'm concerned..
Anyway once again, I'm so glad that everything worked out and that your Mustang is back up and running like a champ once again..
-Rocky
Thank you fastback (Rocky), appreciate it! I'm also one of those guys that like to document everything. I could do the exhaust or fuel filter I did because I didn't want pb blaster or fuel all over my phone lol. If a mod would like to take the "fix" post In this thread and make it a sticky on the removing broken spark plug porcelain peices from a cylinder I surely wouldn't be mad lol
Worked like a charm! I think I had the 3 pieces out in under 10 minutes using that method.
Also would like to add, I bought the different diameter hoses at a local lowes for a total of $1.66, and that's including New Yorks high taxes lol. I bought two different hoses since I wasn't sure if one would be to large to "maneuver" in the hole or if the smaller one would be to small to grab it. But all and all one of them worked. I probably spent a total of $100-$150 just in plugs and tools for a silly mistake.
Glad to hear it all worked out for you!
And way to go not giving up on it!
I'm just very confused on how an extra 12 ft lbs of tq broke the porcelain.
I personally think it was the socket that you originally used caused the porcelain to break!
I have probably changed an honest 800+ spark plugs in my life and have worked in many auto shops and have never heard of breaking the porcelain on a plug by over tightening, but I have broken porcelain tips by having the wrong socket or pinching the plug from a bad angel.
I just had to comment because I'm confused, I'm not trying to start an argument,
I'm just confused on this idea of an extra 12 ft lbs breaking all the plugs!
Being that you've worked in many auto shops, you should also realize there's a very good reason why the manufacturer requires the recommended torque specifications to begin with which happens to include over torquing..
So let's just say that even if the breaking of the porcelain was not directly related by over tightening but rather from using the wrong socket or pinching the spark plug from a bad angle.. There are also other factors to take into consideration as well, such as damaging the threads in both the heads and plugs, as we're referring to aluminum heads and not cast iron..
I would also take into consideration that an over torqued plug would be even more difficult to extract due from being that much tighter inside the head which would then require additional force/torque to break it lose and by doing so would just increase the risk of the plug breaking inside the head anyhow..
At any rate, regardless as to whether or not the wrong socket or pinching the plug from a bad angle was directly responsible for breaking of the porcelain.. Having an over torqued spark plug would still never the less be considered as a contributing factor as far as I'm concerned..
Therefore once again, the manufacturer requires following the recommended torque specifications for a reason and that reason is to prevent any potential damages..
Last edited by m05fastbackGT; 1/20/17 at 07:15 AM.
Being that you've worked in many auto shops, you should also realize there's a very good reason why the manufacturer requires the recommended torque specifications to begin with which happens to include over torquing..
So let's just say that even if the breaking of the porcelain was not directly related by over tightening but rather from using the wrong socket or pinching the spark plug from a bad angle.. There are also other factors to take into consideration as well, such as damaging the threads in both the heads and plugs, as we're referring to aluminum heads and not cast iron..
I would also take into consideration that an over torqued plug would be even more difficult to extract due from being that much tighter inside the head which would then require additional force/torque to break it lose and by doing so would just increase the risk of the plug breaking inside the head anyhow..
At any rate, regardless as to whether or not the wrong socket or pinching the plug from a bad angle was directly responsible for breaking of the porcelain.. Having an over torqued spark plug would still never the less be considered as a contributing factor as far as I'm concerned..
Therefore once again, the manufacturer requires following the recommended torque specifications for a reason and that reason is to prevent any potential damages..
I agree with everything you just stated, there are many reasons NOT to over tighten the spark plug. My comment was just I had never seen over tightening of a spark plug cause that damage, especially on all the plugs!
But the most important thing is that he got it fixed and all is well with his car!
When it comes to Ford, who knows Kyle.. They do however mention using high-temp nickel anti-seize in the TSB, but then again this was only after it became a problem related issue.. At any rate, if only I had been aware of the spark plug issues prior to purchasing my first S197 in 2004, I would've held out and waited for the 2008 job 3 models that came with the new revised heads and plugs instead..
-Rocky
And again, that's only on the 4.6 liter motor that had all the spark plug problems. There's no clear direction from Ford on what to do with the 5.0.
@grimesd - glad this all worked out for you. This is a GREAT forum thread and example of why forums are useful, unlike a lot of the posting here, especially over the winter!
1/19/17, 12:28 PM
