Moejoe_989

Hello guys!

I'm a pretty active member here since purchasing my first mustang September 2013.

Ever since I was a kid, I've always wanted to restore an older car. Mustang, Bel-Air, Camaro, Challenger, Cutlass etc.
My dad and his brothers (all car guys) keep telling me it's better to purchase some turn-key. All ready to go.

I agree with that, but I'm not willing to over-pay a ton of money for someone else's work.
I know it's cliche, but you get what you pay for.
All that being said, I'm hoping some of the more experienced folks can lend me some advice:

I'll narrow down what I'm looking for: I'd be happy with mustang from 1964 - 1973. But to me, a 64 to a 67 is a classic. 68-71 is just a pure muscle car. It doesn't have to be all original, or numbers matching. It definitely doesn't have to be perfect.
Just something I can climb into and say "this is all mine."

When I look on Kijiji there is a nice 1973 Mustang Grande for sale.
"Turn-key. Runs good. Needs a little body work. Paint looks great. 302 auto. Candy apple red for $8,000. "

http://www.kijiji.ca/v-classic-cars/...ang/1041650376

A 1972 mustang:
"302,4 barrel ,automatic transmission, air induction hood, this car runs excellent and is rust free, Motor is nice and clean with no leaks, you can drive this car home with no problems."

http://www.kijiji.ca/v-classic-cars/...ent/1046431139


But then there is a 1967 302 auto for sale for $2800.
"Has a running 302 5.0L engine with automatic transmission
Comes with brand new front fenders, driver side rear quarter panel and front valance.
Missing several interior panels and most of the glass. Front buckets are mint."

http://www.kijiji.ca/v-classic-cars/...800/1047859838



I guess it's hard to judge without you guys seeing the pictures. I'll link the ads but not sure if that's really allowed.

I guess the big question is; how much time and cash am I willing to devote to this? Well, whatever time I can spare on the weekends.
I don't have a garage of tools, but I can borrow what might be needed besides the basic handtools.
I have an attached garage myself, as well as a few friends with attached garages so I can always work on it there.

My dad was a mechanic so I know a little bit about that stuff, but there's a youtube video for most anything nowadays anyway. Plus the Chilton and Hayes car repair manuals are somewhat cheap.

Id be fine with used parts as well. She doesn't have to be a show stopper, just something to be proud of.

Any advice for a young pup like me?

Glenn

A little body usually turns into a lot of body. Bubbling paint can turn into a 4 inch hole real quickly. Be prepared for that. I would try and find a whole car running or not. One that hasn't been messed with much, That way you will know at least what it right and wrong with it.

Moejoe_989

Any other replies?

Glenn

How much body work have you done? I just took the time to check your links out that first one looks nice. The last one looks like a total redo. Have you looked for any Cougars?

fstbck70

Personally, I'd avoid the post '71 MY. I am biased since I own a '70, but the "undesirable" era of Mustang started after '71. No offense to any of those car owners haha. Also, don't settle on the first thing you see. I purchased the first one I physically looked at. Most times you'll miss a lot of small defects that turn into big problems. Be patient when buying. Also note overall worth of the car should play a role in deciding on a purchase. Remember fastbacks>coupes>grande's.

As for time and money, double the money you think you'll spend and triple the amount of time you'll spend fixing it and you may get a good estimate But for real, it's always more than what you originally expect. Money gets tight or priorities change. **** happens lol. But if you do purchase, be sure to have a shop/garage where you can work on it. Having the space to work will drastically improve the efficiency and quality of your work.

Learn to do the work if you don't already. Learn to weld, paint, tune, assemble, etc.. You'll save a fortune if you can do your own body work and paint. Read, YouTube, ask anyone/everyone your questions and then it becomes second nature.

If you want, you can check out my project thread -> 1970 Fastback Build Thread. Scroll down a little bit haha. It's been awhile since I've updated. You can get some ideas of the work/time I've put into mine. I've spent about 3 years and 5 G's to get it where it's at now. But that is like averaging less then 2 days a month . I've probably got about $20,000 to go before its all said and done. But it sure is fun as hell.

AlsCobra

Honestly none of the cars you posted would be worth the trouble of restoring. Unless you don't mind taking a loss on the car or keeping it forever. 67-68 fastback is worth it 1st gen. But it's not much of a hot rod or handler. Even the stupid Eleanor car.
69-70 fastback is well worth the work and can be a real fun car. My personal favorite.

71+ I just don't like and doesn't seem like a favorite among collectors.

You can put $30k into a 1st or 2nd gen coupe easy and it will never be worth that much. 69-70 fastbacks seem to be worth whatever you put into them and more.

Moejoe_989

When I looked, I wanted a 67-69 but the only things for sale seem to be 66-67 years. The 72 grandes posted don't seem to be rust buckets so that's why they were appealing.
But I'd really want a 66-67-68-69.

The 67 I posted looks kind of ok; I'd probably buy another parts car but then that's having 2 cars around to make one good one. That seems silly and costly.

ElkGroveFordGuy

Here is my 2 cents!
I have had and restored 10 pre 1970 mustangs.
The cheapest to restore are 1964 to 1966, parts are every where and cheaper than any other years!(parts wise)
Coupes are easier to find and cheaper, but when you are all done you will wish you had a fast back! ( or at least that was my story)
Buy the cleanest car you can afford and as stock as you can find, then make it your own!
This will be the most economical way to go!
If built right they can cruise, do 1/4 mi. , and carve a corner!
Mine can cruise and get 20 mpg! Run the 1/4 mi. In 12.7 sec, and nail down a road course!
Here's a pic of my 1965 fastback! (For the record it is a classic muscle car!)

Moejoe_989

That's a 65?! Wow. That looks iconic. And, it is!
Wow. That's what I would want

ElkGroveFordGuy

Thanks!

Glenn

How much body work have you done? Do you plan on doing your own body and paint work?

Moejoe_989

I've done zero body work before. (Cutting/welding/body filler)
But I've done some painting and have friends that do auto body paint as well.

Glenn

I've done some body work that didn't turm out top badly. Its the painting part that I'm not so good at. I need some hands on training as far as proper air pressure, air paint mixture and what ever else I should pay attention too while using the paint gun

houtex

Are you prepared for a time, effort, and money pit?

Any of those are then fine candidates, especially the 67.

If you are, in fact, not prepared to spend a ton of time, or a whole lot of effort (including learning things you've never done before, like body panels, paint, upholstery (AND doing it more than once, tearing it back down so you can learn and do it *right*, or not at all) ) and/or a crapton of money to get things done/buy parts you need... oh, and you don't have about two cars worth of space to donate... one for the car, and the other for anything you're working on to go on/in the car... and even a paint booth perhaps... and of course tools you never thought you'd need, but now you do... Or you can't acquire these things you'll need...

Then you do not need to play with this concept. It can get really over your head in a hurry.

For what it's worth, my '66 I6 coupe (Muskrat, as mentioned below) took two years of weekends and about 10000 to do in 1990s dollars. Too much time and effort and money for me to have just sold it like I did. Dumb decisions all the way around.

I *had* wanted to drive her all the time. Wound up with a show car that I was nervous to drive at all because I'd spent all that time and effort, and didn't want her stolen or bent. I regret the selling to this day. Car's dead now, I hear, bounced out of a corn field years ago.

I tell you that so you understand my diatribe in the first place. Prepare yourself. Make sure you WANT that bad enough.

Otherwise, just buy one you can enjoy now, it's simpler that way.

Moejoe_989

I really appreciate this reality check. I guess that's why everyone told me to purchase a car that's already finished or nearly complete.

As much as I *want* a 66-69 Mustang, I could probably settle for one of those 72 mustangs. Or something that's not rear. I could settle for a 66 mustang that's complete. With ripped seats. A 289 engine. And sitting in primer.
Then it would be complete and I could work on those things one at a time.

Body panels or welding I couldn't do well enough for the car. I could do a little bondo though.

houtex

Yep, that's why. People generally start these kinds of projects with no real idea what they're getting into. It just seems like a 'fun thing to do!' and turns into a 'Good LORD, when is this ever getting finshed? And geez, the money!'

But... having said that... I wouldn't trade the experience I had with Muskrat (even though it did suck up all my weekends) because she wound up in a magazine, won a few trophies, and it was overall a nice experience for a few years after. Still, the overall dread of "when is she gonna get hurt?!" was over my head all the time I drove her. It was the better decision at the time... but like I told Arin about his II... Don't EVER let it go. 20/20 hindsight, that.

Which is why I always say that barring an absolute *disaster*, Awesome will be in my grubby mitts until I expire. She's the car I wanted all this time, turns out. I'll throw an auto trans and 'puter in her if my legs quit workin' right before I give her up, as an example.

And see that PC800, Ride, below? I restored that. Ride her as much as I can. And although her panels are starting to be made of unobtainum, and yes, I did have her painted in strange colors that are going to basically require a whole body repaint if they come to be damaged.... Don't care. I ain't lettin' her go easily. Not like I did Muskrat.

Although, to be honest, the parts situation may *dictate* I let her be retired and be a standing piece of artwork, or sell her to someone who can better put her to use. Thankfully, there's a cadre of PC800 fanatics like myself who I'm sure would be happy to take her off my hands...

But until then. Both of these things are *MINE*.

And in that vein, I say make your decision. If you're going to absolutely keep the project, then the money and time is worth it. If you're going to play with it and then dump it, well... that's your call.

I wish ya luck on whichever road ya take, Joe. Both are worthy. And it is, after all, the journeys and experiences that this thing called Life is about, wouldn't ya agree?

Glenn

Maybe find something with a really good body that needs a engine or trans rebuild. I'm on my second flip that started out with a bad engine.

Moejoe_989

Houtex, thanks for the honest and straight forward reply.

And Glenn, I'm torn between getting something local (which is probably covered in rust)
Or getting something from Ebay (which needs to be shipped)

Like You guys said, get something with a strong body.
Everything else I can do myself or with help. If it's has a bad 289, I'll replace it with a 350 crate engine or something used.
If it's covered in primer or surface rust, I'll paint it myself.
Changes are I'd want a colour change anyway. I'd probably paint it jet black, or maybe grabber
Blue to match mine.

It doesn't need to be a show stopper right away, I'd work up to that. But I'd like to be able to get on it and smoke those rear tires!!!

ford4v429

a few comments...
first, much as I love them, old mustangs eared that snide 'rustang' nickname for a reason- expect bad things unless it came from Arizona or something. being unibody, everything involves welding after tedious sectioning- scary stuff for most folks, and the kind of things that result in burnout/abandonment of many a project...

that stuff aside, some logistic concerns that really were enlightening to me- long story, but my old neighbor/friend gave me his baby- a 65 galaxie he had bought new, had been stored since 78, and hadnt been driven since around 99... he had been ill for a long time, lost his wife in 2001, was more like a Dad to me than a friend, anyways, decided to try and do my best to get the old gal running. it looked good except for some shoddy bodywork he had done by a new bodyshop in town... made a promise to myself and God to do my best to get that car roadworthy for him, whatever it took... boy did I get tested. ha it been really 'mine' I'd have had to scrap it after the first couple days- it was definitely going to be more than brakes and fuel system repairs.
Got it driveable/brakes/fuel fixed in a few weeks, but the chassis was shot. did enough jacking/prying, felt strong enough to at least be safe to go around the block, took it to Ben's he drove it around the neighborhood happy as a lark...I didnt have the heart to tell him the frame was shot, but as he saw it, it looked/ran good as ever... but I couldnt give it back in that shape. over about a year, he recovered pretty much from his heart attack, I got the nerve up to tell him I needed to pull the body for safety reasons- he was kinda upset - surely the 69 mustang I had in pieces since 1984 had him worried.

but it had to be done. I spent a year (03-04) messing around with that car, got in so far over my head it still surprises me we got it done...Ben did live long enough to get to drive it one more time after it was finished, but refused to take it back...he quit driving just a couple weeks after and we lost him sept 04...sorry, got a bit sidetracked-

back on the subject of logistics. I had a 3 car garage, with a extra bay I built on for a workshop- most folks woulda said it was a pretty big garage for a residential area- it was 800 sqft, wasnt allowed to be any larger unattached.
OK, put a 65 LTD in a 3 car garage- tons of room, even with the 69 mustang against the wall... now pull the hood/fenders/doors/seats/trunklid/other large items... hmm- out of room, haul interior to brothers house, doors to brother in laws, get the hood/trunk in the rafters. time to pull the engine/trans/fenderwells, rest of interior, fueltank, suspension= halfway thru, the pride and joy mustang gets rolled outside for the first time in near 20 yrs... ok, now pull the body off the frame... lift equipment, jacks, cherrypicker, a bizillion loose easily damaged parts carefully boxed so they dont get lost...you get the picture. I had parts stashed in my attic/basement/every friend that had a little room to loan- and still the pile kept growing. had it not been someone elses 'baby' I woulda gave up halfway thru. a disassembled car turns into a mountain of parts in a huge hurry- and this car was a shiny original paint(except quarters) thing, so all those bulky parts had to be handled with kidgloves.

say a mustang needs floors- just a couple hundred bucks worth of tin and some welds, sounds easy to do in a one car garage... but best to remove the doors, interior- boy the stuff piles up. then say you see some inner wheelhouse issues, that grows into quarters, rockers... in a few weeks theres a garage full of fragile 'stuff' and a hopeless looking kinda car shaped mess thats looking less and less like a 'cant wait to burn the tires off this thing' project once envisioned.

I would be the last guy on earth to try to discourage anyone believe me- kudos for the drive to dive in... but after being thru one, its like folks say- everything costs more/takes longer... if you are going to get into it, seriously, dont expect anything to be easy...even the 'easy' stuff becomes a chore after working all day, then spending a few hours drilling out rust...know what I mean? please underestimate abilities, and at least double any 'worst case' budget- then letdowns wont be as bad, and suff that does go like clockwork will leave you feeling like you won the olympics or something
I cant stress enough about the room issue though- that was my biggest single problem then- and now still as Ive collected too much junk

if you are into rust, heres some pics of the old 65 LTD project, and the 69 as it still sits today...

http://www.fordmuscleforums.com/gala...ong-story.html

https://www.flickr.com/photos/832321...7634916492409/